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Gentlemen and Ladies,

As the granola-eating, liberal, bleeding-heart, car hating, Prius driving, AXX wipe that wrote the "Scathing Super Bee" review some of you took issue with, I thought it might be fair for me to drop a line and weigh in, if nobody minds.

On a personal note: I like burgers, not granola. I've never voted for a Democrat for president. I hate the Prius and think it's just about the worst car on sale in America. I don't wear sandals unless I'm going to the beach, and I'm a gun owner. I also don't hate cars.

As for the Super Bee, I think some of you folks mis-took the tone of my review of the Superbee. Yes, lots of people (Prius drivers) would hate this car, and that's what I was getting at in the review. But I'm not one of those people, and I don't hate the Super Bee at all. In fact, when I said that firing up the engine kills a baby seal somewhere, I meant it as a compliment.

What I tried to emphasize in the TTAC article, is that it's an issue of taste. Most of the reactions I read here seem to suggest I hit the nail on the head. The Super Bee is perfect for some people, not good for others. Do you guys buy cars on the basis of their CO2 emissions, gas mileage, or to blend into the background? Of course not. Odds are good you love the Super Bee because of the qualities I highlighted: it has unique style, it's big, it's comfortable, and it's very powerful.

I completely stand by my complaint about the airbag situation on the Super Bee. It's inexcusable for a $45,000 car to have "optional" side airbags and come standard with 2. Many of the cars on dealer lots only had the 2 airbags. This isn't a global warming debate, airbags make a huge difference in crash safety, and it was nearly a dealbreaker for my old man when he was shopping for one of these.

I appreciate the reactions, and quite honestly I'm flattered that so many of you read what I had to say and thought about it. But keep in mind what I was really saying: if you like the Charger for what it has to offer, you aren't part of the automotive mainstream. You like the Charger because it's not part of the mainstream. That's the farthest thing from an insult I can think of.
 

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Wow. Thanks for coming in an expressing yourself, Justin. I know I'm not part of the automotive mainstream, and damn proud of that fact.

The mainstream, folks, is my one co-worker, 24 years old, bought an Acura TSX, or the 42 yo, who bought a Camry. The folks who seek folks like us out for advice about cars:)

Let me see if I can dig up a real biased review, one done years back on the SRT-4, by a guy in Florida. Complete hatchet job, gugy didnt even bother to learn anything about the car.
 

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I appreciate the reactions, and quite honestly I'm flattered that so many of you read what I had to say and thought about it.
As the OP, you can thank me for the readership. Nice article. :knockout:
 

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I completely stand by my complaint about the airbag situation on the Super Bee. It's inexcusable for a $45,000 car to have "optional" side airbags and come standard with 2. Many of the cars on dealer lots only had the 2 airbags. This isn't a global warming debate, airbags make a huge difference in crash safety, and it was nearly a dealbreaker for my old man when he was shopping for one of these.
I would prefer to not have side air bags. It's absolutely amazing how many cars where the side airbag does absolutely nothing, basically useless. Before you start bashing me, I work for an auto mfg in new product development, and have seen my employers data, as well as most of the competitors. Too many accidents occur where the side airbags are ineffective, and the vehicle suffers from a loss of headroom.

Besides, all that mechanism adds additional wt and slows down the $45,000 car, LOL.
 

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That was pretty honorable of you Justin and I appreciate you coming on here and expressing your point of view. I agree with you about the side airbags and I made sure I got them with my SRT8.
 

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I personally thought I felt the tone in the article you were trying to impart, but every once in a while I totally missed some of the sarcasm. I WILL say that the baby seal line was phenomenal. hehehehe
 

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Justin,
I reread your review and I can see where you're coming from.
I traded in an Infiniti for my charger and I must admit the inside and safety features on the G35 were better. But once I saw my SRT8 I was stuck on it.
The car got into my head like no other car I've ever had. I've had some really high dollar cars and no car I've had gets the attention this car does. It just feels cool to drive this thing. I think thats the passion you get from the owners on this forum. We LOVE these cars... so we are sensitive to the perception of somebody insulting it. Glad you clarified your feelings.

Jim
 

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Honorable???

Please.

This posting is a joke. You published your opinion on the car for all to see and read.

And now you want to clarify and amend what you originally published?

Sorry if I don't buy it.

You made your opinions clear. Have the balls to stand by them.

-=FLEX=-
 

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Lighten up, Francis.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
But regardless, this guy is a goof.
Uh, I am completely standing by what I wrote in the first place. It's just that I never trashed the Charger in the original TTAC article. What I was trying to do by posting here was to explain the article because it seems like some folks didn't understand it. I don't mean any disrespect, but the article didn't say that I hate the Charger, and if you actually read what I wrote I think that would be clear. It's a fun car, and in my opinion (just like the opinion to which you are entitled) it has some serious flaws.

I posted here in the first place so if you had a question or comment about my original article, you could address it with me rather than resorting to baseless name calling as many people did initially. If you want to take the opportunity to call me a "goof," that's your decision.
 

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Justin, your writing style is rich with wit and sarcasm, perhaps too much so in this case. It almost seemed like you went a bit overboard on this, and forgot to actually review the car. That said, welcome to the board, and I would like to hear your witty view on the sea of brown-gray Camrys that I need to slalom through each morning :lol: .
 

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Um, I must have missed the original diatribe....
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
FLEX,

Sorry to hear you feel that way. Yes, I had plenty of negative comments (and they are more about how the general public will perceive the SRT8), but consider also:

"And a hell of an engine it is. Four hundred and twenty five horses are enough to propel this brick ****house to 60mph in five seconds. As momentum equals mass times velocity, accelerating that quickly in a 4200 lb car is an astonishing experience. The engine is suitably loud, and every slam on the gas (gently depressing the go-pedal is like using the rhythm method with Marissa Miller) yields ferocious thrust."

"we should be glad cars like the Super Bee exist."

"tail out powerslides"


___

The other thing I forgot to mention, and this goes for anyone that thinks I'm way off basis with my review - Write! The Truth About Cars would be happy to accept your submission of a counter-review. Use the contact form on www.ttac.com to get in touch with the editor about how to do this.
 

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Justin, your writing style is rich with wit and sarcasm, perhaps too much so in this case. It almost seemed like you went a bit overboard on this, and forgot to actually review the car.
Exactly

Each car should be evaluated versus competing cars in its class. While there are no direct competitors there are several similar cars that are just slightly down one continuum or another.

The M45 is more luxury but still a relatively large car that performs. The CTS-V was a little more expensive, smaller, but aimed at a similar market.

But what is really objectionable are these statements:

Good news: people buying the Dodge Super Bee probably won’t care any more about the car’s low-grade interior than they do about CO2 emissions warming/cooling the planet.
This statement implies that the Charger is a 1960s style pollution machine and that is not true.

So fire-up the Super Bee’s honking 6.1-liter Hemi and a baby seal dies somewhere.
More hyperbole that is misleading. The 6.1 gets better gas mileage than most of these jumbo SUVs that people have bought in droves over the past decade. How many of them can average mid 20s on the highway?

But the combination of double-wide tires and massive torque means that driving the Super Bee requires less finesse than throwing a water balloon at the side of a barn. In fact, Dodge couldn’t left off the steering wheel entirely; directional change is just as easily accomplished with your right foot as with the decapitated turtle that passes for a tiller.
Again, not only is this poorly written but it is misleading. While the SRT8 doesn't have the handling precision of a M3 or CTS-V, it is a very respectable handler for a large family sedan and not even close to what you describe.

It follows the old formula of sticking a huge and powerful engine into a hum-drum big car. Of course, we’ve got better safety these days.
This is pure garbage. Hum-drum cars don't have advanced ESP, Brembo brakes, control arm front suspension, multi-link rear suspension, and outstanding high speed stability well past 150mph.

Instead, since you decided to ignore the actual performance design of the car you rant about side airbags like they are some be-all end-all of safety.

When an author misses important details and focuses on small issues then you have an article which people are going to think is crap.
 

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See, folks this is how you take issue without calling names. I might point out to M that its not fair to say that Justin didnt compare the SRT to other cars in its "class", like the M45 or the CTS-V, but when it came to mileage, M bought up SUVs, not those same competitors:)

No names called, opinions are NOT facts, and facts must be backed up. Thats how debate works.
 

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I completely stand by my complaint about the airbag situation on the Super Bee. It's inexcusable for a $45,000 car to have "optional" side airbags and come standard with 2. Many of the cars on dealer lots only had the 2 airbags. This isn't a global warming debate, airbags make a huge difference in crash safety, and it was nearly a dealbreaker for my old man when he was shopping for one of these.
I personally had no problem with your review. Afterall, it's an opinion. I must say that I was dissappointed that the side airbags were optional, and unavailable when I bought mine. But, in fairness I think it's dissappointing how many cars have stability control as an oprion. In fact considering the Charger's crash ratings, even without side airbags, I'd rather be driving a Charger sans airbags, with it's standard stability control than any of those other cars, sans stability control.
After all, the best way to survive and accident is to avoid it.
 

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See, folks this is how you take issue without calling names. I might point out to M that its not fair to say that Justin didnt compare the SRT to other cars in its "class", like the M45 or the CTS-V, but when it came to mileage, M bought up SUVs, not those same competitors:)

No names called, opinions are NOT facts, and facts must be backed up. Thats how debate works.
Good point

After 50,000 miles I would say that compared to similar cars these are the positives and negatives

+
top end power is unsurpassed
exceptional grip
brakes
looks (subjective of course)
value (for a car of this size with more power you have to pay a whole lot more)

-
steering feel is not up to M class or CTS-V
suspension tuning (springs hard - shocks too soft)
interior quality could be better
gas mileage mediocre (partly a product of weight)

What I object to in the article is that it paints the SRT8 as if it is some 60s reincarnation but about the only thing on the car that could be considered low-tech is a pushrod engine. But that engine is so refined that it outperforms any ohc design of similar cost and size. The platform is not low-tech at all. It could use some additional refinement, but is it not even close to 60s technology.

The Mustang is the reverse. It uses a ohc engine but puts it in a body that is pretty much 80s state-of-the-art.
 
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