[ITsGOTaHEMI?]

has anyone tried installing an oil cooler like the B&M super cooler?

wondering if it would be helpful with all that heat sink we have going on.

 

[arfur]

The vehicle would have been fitted with oil coolers where necessary (I think the power steering and possibly the tranny already have them?). If it's not there from the factory it's not needed. UNLESS you plan on using it harder and faster than normal fast road use.... Like continual track racing?

 

[ITsGOTaHEMI?]

ya. i mean i love the car as a daily driver. but i do want to be able to take it out to the tracks on occasion. of course as soon as i start modding the engine. :knockout:

 

[smoke]

mopar super center sells the factory police package oil cooler.

I'll see if I can find the thread.


Here you go, there are a couple of other threads about the install
if you search.

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34285&highlight=police+oil+cooler

 

[dudeiwin86]

now what does an oil cooler do for a daily driver with medium modification(i.e. stock engine but most if not all other things) and an occasional track visit... as far as perf gains

does having cooler oil keep your engine cooler? i thought it needed a certain oil temp for a certain viscosity

 

[arfur]

now what does an oil cooler do for a daily driver with medium modification(i.e. stock engine but most if not all other things) and an occasional track visit... as far as perf gains

does having cooler oil keep your engine cooler? i thought it needed a certain oil temp for a certain viscosity

Well - it won't do anything other than increase the time it takes for the oil to reach 'operating' temperature.

The oil cooler is added to engine to stop the oil continually operating over 160 Deg C (or thereabouts), cos this fecks it up. Which results in the oil not protecting the engine properly.

And you're right, the oil/engine are designed to work together in an 'optimum' temp area (or a tad below) to ensure that the viscosity of the oil is at it's best for the harshest of driving conditions.

 

[smoke]

does having cooler oil keep your engine cooler?

From posts I've seen it's a few degrees drop in avg oil temp.


i thought it needed a certain oil temp for a certain viscosity

from what I know true, but I don't think a few degrees is enough
to put you under the threshold there.

I think it's main purpose would be to help cool the engine off a
little faster after some abuse as well as keep it cooler during
extended high speed runs.

 

[ITsGOTaHEMI?]

well to be honest, im not the most friendly driver out there. I like to DRIVE my car pretty hard. dont get me wrong though, i take care of her (change the oil every 1500) and i keep it clean. i just dont like it when its 100 degrees outside and i shut my car off after i run the poop out it racing some punk. the temp is always up 10 degrees. i would just feel safer with some more cooling. but i dont know. thats why i ask you more experienced guys.

 

[DonatoM3]

well to be honest, im not the most friendly driver out there. I like to DRIVE my car pretty hard. dont get me wrong though, i take care of her (change the oil every 1500) and i keep it clean. i just dont like it when its 100 degrees outside and i shut my car off after i run the poop out it racing some punk. the temp is always up 10 degrees. i would just feel safer with some more cooling. but i dont know. thats why i ask you more experienced guys.

The engine oil will take about as long to cool down when the car is off with or without the extra cooler. The cooler will make it so that the engine is a few degrees cooler when you park it though.

And 1500 that's a bit overkill, but it's better to overdo it than underdo it I guess.

 

[arfur]

well to be honest, im not the most friendly driver out there. I like to DRIVE my car pretty hard. dont get me wrong though, i take care of her (change the oil every 1500) and i keep it clean. i just dont like it when its 100 degrees outside and i shut my car off after i run the poop out it racing some punk. the temp is always up 10 degrees. i would just feel safer with some more cooling. but i dont know. thats why i ask you more experienced guys.

OK - so when we tested fords (yes - I know - a swear word...) the engine oil was monitored on most of the 'harsh conditions' tests. For example, 40 Deg C ambient, with solar loading, 4th gear, WOT, 180kph. This test would be carried out for as long as was needed by the guys needing the data, or until the car blew up (I actually trashed the first RS Focus in the UK on the rolling road during testing.....). The results of engine, transmission, diff, battery etc were all monitored and assessed during and post testing. If the oil was getting too hot, it was back to the drawing board (oil cooler, bigger sump, etc). If it was steady state, then we were happy.

Now, I'm assuming that the testing of the Charger would have involved WOT at high ambients for extended periods of time - at high speed. If the car did not come with an oil cooler, it is highly likely that the various oils stayed within acceptable tolerances.

Now - we had trouble with the diffs on the Jags ('S', or 'X', maybe both) where the diff oil continued to climb during these tests and resulted in the oil eventually passing the acceptable temp limit. I don't know what they eventually did to fix it, but I'm sure they would have done something!

 

[ITsGOTaHEMI?]

thanks Arfur.

thats the kind of motivation i needed to hear. haha i just need that wonderful peace of mind.


:rockon:

 

[smoke]

Now, I'm assuming that the testing of the Charger would have involved WOT at high ambients for extended periods of time - at high speed. If the car did not come with an oil cooler, it is highly likely that the various oils stayed within acceptable tolerances.

I'm assuming they did this as well. I'd also guess that it was very close to said tolerances so hence the oil cooler factory installed on the police package hemi.

 

[arfur]

I'm assuming they did this as well. I'd also guess that it was very close to said tolerances so hence the oil cooler factory installed on the police package hemi.

That could have been fitted due to the Police vehicle potantially having to sit around at the side of the road at idle, with a loaded alternator (flashing lights/headlights etc) and the air-con going for hours on end in some of the hottest places on Earth/in the US. If the baseline requires that the vehicle be able to sit at +50 Deg C at idle, with full auxiliaries being used with added Solar Loading, then yes, the engine oil temp might keep creeping up. Then there's the potential for the same ambient conditons whilst in persuit (High load, high speed) for hours on end.

If there was any risk of frying the oil with the standard Charger, there would have been an oil cooler. However, increasing the performance of the vehicle could start to push the engines standard oil cooling capabilities towards the upper edge of the envelope. . So - lots of high performance mods 'could' require the addition of an oil cooler. But I would say that the vehicle would still need to be operating in very high ambients for this to me a major issue. But at the end of the day - I don't have the numbers for this particular vehicle, so just bouncing off of theory.

 

[bloodstripe23]

so unless we have superchargers, lots of engine work and other mods theres the oil cooler will hurt our cars?

 

[arfur]

so unless we have superchargers, lots of engine work and other mods theres the oil cooler will hurt our cars?

No - other than making the oil warm-up time extend. And cost money. And add extra weight (of the cooler/piping and I assume extra engine oil). Plus the oil system has just become more (unecessarily) complicated. It won't (or shouldn't) hurt the car per se.

 

[bloodstripe23]

No - other than making the oil warm-up time extend. And cost money. And add extra weight (of the cooler/piping and I assume extra engine oil). Plus the oil system has just become more (unecessarily) complicated. It won't (or shouldn't) hurt the car per se.

ok cool, so wont hurt the car, but unless I want to just spend/waste money its no point in getting it correct?

 

[RitzRT]

ok cool, so wont hurt the car, but unless I want to just spend/waste money its no point in getting it correct?

I believe that's what he's saying.

Cheers,

 

[Samoan Tsunami]

Well - it won't do anything other than increase the time it takes for the oil to reach 'operating' temperature.

The oil cooler is added to engine to stop the oil continually operating over 160 Deg C (or thereabouts), cos this fecks it up. Which results in the oil not protecting the engine properly.

And you're right, the oil/engine are designed to work together in an 'optimum' temp area (or a tad below) to ensure that the viscosity of the oil is at it's best for the harshest of driving conditions.

hey brah, thanx for the timing belt post some time back! just finally got around to REFINDING it.

heres something that might add more to this talk. some of the companys are coming out with a remedy to the temp dealie you spoke on, uso. heres the style i run on my autoX car

http://www.bmracing.com/index.php?id=products&sid=4&cat=20&subcat=&pid=382

B&M SuperCoolers are 100% aluminum construction and use stamped plates sandwiched together to create one of the most efficient oil cooling devices available. Not only does this unique design provide for maximized cooling through more efficient heat dissipation but it also provides a much sturdier cooler which is practically impervious to flying rocks or other debris. The Super-Coolers intended for automatic transmission fluid also offer an additional feature known as “Low Pressure Drop”. The coolers assembled with hose barb ends include a unique bypass feature allowing a controlled amount of ATF to bypass the stacked plate core when the fluid is cold. This is beneficial in cold climate areas to guard against lube system failure. Controlled by viscosity, fluid is returned directly to the lube circuit through bypass openings in the stacked plate core. As the temperature increases, more ATF is directed through the core. This highly efficient design combines improved protection against lube system failure with the required levels of optimal heat transfer.

this one in specific deals with transmission oil, but there are a few engine oil coolers that allow the same process.

get the best of both worlds, and especially if you have a daily driver. no need to change out over the winter months, ya! it basically bypasses the cooler fins until a certain temp. like if you were sitting in traffic or an accident traffic. bypasses it till it gets to a certain temp, then opens....closes when below certain temp.

:grin:


also, i;d reccomend finding out a way to monitor oil temps, be it transmission or engine FIRST, before adding any coolers. not only will it determine if you actually need one, but how tall or long the cooler you will need to purchase. for example, my transmission temps with the upgraded torque conveter and vavle body and pump kept me in the 207 degree F range.

trans fluid is 175-195 operating temps. rule of thumb for ever 20 over, it halfs the life. three traffic lights leaving the city, i'd already reach 219 degrees F. i reached 237 ONCE.... (scared the mahi mahi outta me) so i added a faily large cooler and now i range at 180-190 temps during traffic, 174 on the road in air flow.

 

[Buck70]

Maybe not

Well - it won't do anything other than increase the time it takes for the oil to reach 'operating' temperature.

And you're right, the oil/engine are designed to work together in an 'optimum' temp area (or a tad below) to ensure that the viscosity of the oil is at it's best for the harshest of driving conditions.

Arfur
Good point about designed operating temps, you do have to flash off the condensation. BUT, if memory serves from auto shop 30 years ago, the water comes up to temp long before the oil. SO, the inverse occurs here too.

The oil (cooler) will actually warm the oil quicker to the point where it matches water temp, then cool it after it passes the water temp/T-stat range. People with the cop cooler have confirmed this occurs.
DB