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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
just for starters im 17 and i have a 2010 charger r/t with 168k miles that i got a little under a year ago as my first car that the previous owner said he bought in texas from someone who raced it and had a blower on it. the blower was removed before i bought it and a junkyard 5.7 intake was put in its place as well as the truck 5.7 exhaust manifolds the previous owner had no knowledge of what mods since he didn’t build it just said that its “not stock” after having to replace the entire cooling system and finding out the car was still on a boost tune so i got a tune at a reputable shop in town and was confused from the results the car made 347 whp at 6000 and 389 ft at 4200 with 170k miles almost heavy 20” rims and the restrictive 5.7 intake and truck manifolds with 2.82 rear but what confused me was the tuner was able to constistantly rev my car out to 8k with the hp dropping off at 7800 which is normally not herd of from hemis especially older but due to the stock tcm (i have headers, 6.1 tcm and intake and 92mm tb on backorder) he was unable to raise the shift points past 6 so i was wondering if anyone could possibly help me try and figure out what i have done/what i need to do next also if anyone could tell me why torque starts a rapid decline at 4k area isn’t that where the short to long runner switch happens/maybe clogged fuel filter?
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I think you have some parts confused. If you have a 5.7 intake that fits a Charger then you don't have an active intake. Hell, from your description you might jot even have the correct eagle intake lol. It definitely sounds like there's a cam in it. Shift points are controlled by the TCM, should be able to go in and change them. FYI unless you plan to put a blower back on it that 92mm TB will do nothing for you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I think you have some parts confused. If you have a 5.7 intake that fits a Charger then you don't have an active intake. Hell, from your description you might jot even have the correct eagle intake lol. It definitely sounds like there's a cam in it. Shift points are controlled by the TCM, should be able to go in and change them. FYI unless you plan to put a blower back on it that 92mm TB will do nothing for you.
i don’t think anything on the car is correct honestly but hell its a start i want to get the car to live up in the high rpms and it has 6.4 fuel rails and the injectors don’t look stock so my thought was to just cram more air in it but i don’t want to have to tear my whole engine apart to see what i have done already and what im lacking the car definitely has a cam but really not any lope could also be due to the shitty headers but other than that i have no idea the tune shop tunes the car like it’s driving on the street and it was making power until 7800 which isn’t really normal is it going to just ruin everything doing a couple 8k hemi pulls after school or is there some things i should redo due to the higher mileage before the tcm upgrade to unlock the top end its definitely a sticky situation
 

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Need to get a better picture of the dyno for rpm range and some engine bay pictures.

No stock hemi (even fairly modded) is pulling out to 7800 and still making power. So something is amiss with tuner or reading the dyno.

The hp/tq figures are fairly close to what one would expect for an eagle 5.7 in stock shape.


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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Need to get a better picture of the dyno for rpm range and some engine bay pictures.

No stock hemi (even fairly modded) is pulling out to 7800 and still making power. So something is amiss with tuner or reading the dyno.

The hp/tq figures are fairly close to what one would expect for an eagle 5.7 in stock shape.


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i was at the tune and he was making 7500 + each time with a small coolant leak in the driverside hardline and it was in the middle of summer 95-105° but there wasn’t any errors or anything but he was definitely revving far past 5500-6k range it was one of the longest pulls ive herd i also should mention this was just a baseline run just to clean anything up like the leaks and everything before mods and real tune but my dad has a 17’ r/t challenger with the a8 and my charger drives circles around it and was previously blown by previous owners which makes me think this cant be stock and the internals or at least valvetrain is built all exterior bolt on mods appear stock (intake,tb, heads,headers,stock 2300 torque converter and 08’ 2.82 rear) (sorry for blurry images i got a new phone and the only things i have left are from the email dyno video and backedup photos)
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That’s an eagle intake manifold and 6.1/eagle 5.7 injectors so all that looks right as far as stock components.

As far as the dyno, it’s showing max hp/tq at around 5600rpm which is fairly typical for the eagle 5.7s. I wasn’t there for the dyno but from what you are showing, it appears to be very stock (in terms of power output and configuration). That’s not to say that it wasn’t built internally with forged components but i (personally) wouldn’t test that based on what I see right now.

The eagle intakes hold power out in the rpm range better than the previous 5.7 intakes but I’ve never seen one make more power later in the rpm range than stock (i.e. they level out fairly consistently and drop off in power near 56-6000 rpm).

As far as getting into to see what is built and what isn’t, you can pull the valve covers relatively easily and see if pushrods/valve springs have been altered. You can also see if mds has been deleted (common for cam swaps) by simply unbolting the intake and checking the mds solenoids underneath.

I would expect to see stock eagle 5.7s around 320-340 hp and 340-380 tq depending on dyno.
I attached my stock 2013 eagle 5.7 dyno with just longtubes for reference. The peak numbers are of course different but the curves are relatively similar to show how the eagles perform stock.
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
i was at the tune and he was making 7500 + each time with a small coolant leak in the driverside hardline and it was in the middle of summer 95-105° but there wasn’t any errors or anything but he was definitely revving far past 5500-6k range it was one of the longest pulls ive herd i also should mention this was just a baseline run just to clean anything up like the leaks and everything before mods and real tune but my dad has a 17’ r/t challenger with the a8 and my charger drives circles around it and was previously blown by previous owners which makes me think this cant be stock and the internals or at least valvetrain is built all exterior bolt on mods appear stock (intake,tb, heads,headers,stock 2300 torque converter and 08’ 2.82 rear) (sorry for blurry images i got a new phone and the only things i have left are from the email dyno video and backedup photos)
View attachment 301265 View attachment 301266
That’s an eagle intake manifold and 6.1/eagle 5.7 injectors so all that looks right as far as stock components.

As far as the dyno, it’s showing max hp/tq at around 5600rpm which is fairly typical for the eagle 5.7s. I wasn’t there for the dyno but from what you are showing, it appears to be very stock (in terms of power output and configuration). That’s not to say that it wasn’t built internally with forged components but i (personally) wouldn’t test that based on what I see right now.

The eagle intakes hold power out in the rpm range better than the previous 5.7 intakes but I’ve never seen one make more power later in the rpm range than stock (i.e. they level out fairly consistently and drop off in power near 56-6000 rpm).

As far as getting into to see what is built and what isn’t, you can pull the valve covers relatively easily and see if pushrods/valve springs have been altered. You can also see if mds has been deleted (common for cam swaps) by simply unbolting the intake and checking the mds solenoids underneath.

I would expect to see stock eagle 5.7s around 320-340 hp and 340-380 tq depending on dyno.
I attached my stock 2013 eagle 5.7 dyno with just longtubes for reference. The peak numbers are of course different but the curves are relatively similar to show how the eagles perform stock.
View attachment 301268


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it would blow my mind if they boosted a stock bottom end 5.7 above 8psi but anything is possible but whenever i have some free time i plan to pull the valve covers at least because im am almost certain the cam isn’t stock but almost no noise can be produced with the very restrictive stock headers most cam upgrades require longtubes and most people usually also do ported heads or upgraded/ported intake too so without any of that the cam/bottom end power gains wouldn’t show that much but the dyno is also meant to replicate street scenarios or a heavy load and i also have heavy 20” rims from the previous owner
 

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it would blow my mind if they boosted a stock bottom end 5.7 above 8psi but anything is possible but whenever i have some free time i plan to pull the valve covers at least because im am almost certain the cam isn’t stock but almost no noise can be produced with the very restrictive stock headers most cam upgrades require longtubes and most people usually also do ported heads or upgraded/ported intake too so without any of that the cam/bottom end power gains wouldn’t show that much but the dyno is also meant to replicate street scenarios or a heavy load and i also have heavy 20” rims from the previous owner
The rims don't make a difference on the dyno. The track cares, the dyno doesn't give a crap. I made my pulls with 20" rims and 315/35/20 tires on. That combo is almost 60lbs each.

From looking at that dyno sheet, something is off. The torque and HP lines should cross over at 5252 RPMs. Without fail. Yours cross at almost 6000, unless that's actually TIME as it states instead of RPM.

Idk why they would have used time instead of revs, but I've noticed a lot of Dyno sheets being posted with reference points other than RPM (like time and speed) and that leads me to think the tuner's are trying to blow smoke up butts.

Based on what I'm seeing, that's a stock engine and someone else was blowing smoke when you bought it. I could be wrong though, it's happened once or twice. Lol

Here's a sheet from mine being tuned. Notice the RPM reference instead of time or mph. The Dyno is a great tuning tool, but that's it.

Unless you're a bench racer who just likes to sit around and brag about numbers (which vary from dyno to dyno) that can be tweaked and altered to say just about anything by the dyno operator, that's all it's good for. The track tells the honest truth.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
The rims don't make a difference on the dyno. The track cares, the dyno doesn't give a crap. I made my pulls with 20" rims and 315/35/20 tires on. That combo is almost 60lbs each.

From looking at that dyno sheet, something is off. The torque and HP lines should cross over at 5252 RPMs. Without fail. Yours cross at almost 6000, unless that's actually TIME as it states instead of RPM.

Idk why they would have used time instead of revs, but I've noticed a lot of Dyno sheets being posted with reference points other than RPM (like time and speed) and that leads me to think the tuner's are trying to blow smoke up butts.

Based on what I'm seeing, that's a stock engine and someone else was blowing smoke when you bought it. I could be wrong though, it's happened once or twice. Lol

Here's a sheet from mine being tuned. Notice the RPM reference instead of time or mph. The Dyno is a great tuning tool, but that's it.

Unless you're a bench racer who just likes to sit around and brag about numbers (which vary from dyno to dyno) that can be tweaked and altered to say just about anything by the dyno operator, that's all it's good for. The track tells the honest truth.
thats what im lost on the car preforms better than it shows on a sheet but that’s kinda what you want but i don’t believe the tuner was trying to do any smoke and mirrors from a baseline he wasn’t really doing anything but pulling it until the power dropped
it easily beats stock/widebody 392,ss, older 5.0 and is on back fender of the 10speed 5.0s what mods would be the biggest gains from here and also could it have a mild high lift boost cam and thats whats adding some top end power just no hp since its the car is n/a now and it feels laggy until 4-4500 rpms even though it has a good chunk of low end torque and really starts to pick up alot of power then like cuts itself short at 6 especially in autostick because it auto upshifts at 6 and loses all the momentum it had like it truly feels like it wants to rev higher and im not a racer or anything im just a teenager trying to get started
i was planning on just doing a rebuild but its been running great and makes me think it can handle more without a total redo of everything i just don’t know what would be the best route to go or what to get first
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
have a good one i don’t know what the point of lying would be theres no ego in it its a old ass car but i can’t help what it does the point of the thread is to figure out what’s done to it because its not stock isn’t stock hp on a 5.7 270-290 wheel and 6.4 is 330-360 wheel stock so i show 60-70 more wheel than stock eagle 5.7 and almost stock 6.4 numbers without the torque that 6.4 intake and manifold adds while im at 170k miles and there are many forums that show these numbers and have sheets to prove im not trying to act like i have the fastest thing ever but something inside this car isn’t how it came from factory and was just looking for advice if this isn’t for you leave it for someone else to comment
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
have a good one i don’t know what the point of lying would be theres no ego in it its a old ass car but i can’t help what it does the point of the thread is to figure out what’s done to it because its not stock isn’t stock hp on a 5.7 270-290 wheel and 6.4 is 330-360 wheel stock so i show 60-70 more wheel than stock eagle 5.7 and almost stock 6.4 numbers without the torque that 6.4 intake and manifold adds while im at 170k miles and there are many forums that show these numbers and have sheets to prove im not trying to act like i have the fastest thing ever but something inside this car isn’t how it came from factory and was just looking for advice if this isn’t for you leave it for someone else to comment
i also mentioned this dyno has a heavy load everyone that goes there and gets a tune is almost always disappointed with the number produced because they go for realistic and repeatable not as high of a number as possible some have even gone straight to another shop and ran it on their dyno and made a much higher number but this forum was not for the dyno or dyno number as much as id love it if the 5.7 came with 350 wheel and 400 torque stock but in all honesty my dad’s 5.7 bone stock 17’ shaker challenger is nowhere close to 350 wheel and would probably get beat by a altima if the nissan wanted it bad enough but the charger is lacking several bolt on parts that the 6.1 and 6.4 come with stock but its still making equal if not more power even if we say the 5.7 has 300 wheel stock i still have 50 more from somewhere internally especially showing all stock external parts
 

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i also mentioned this dyno has a heavy load everyone that goes there and gets a tune is almost always disappointed with the number produced because they go for realistic and repeatable not as high of a number as possible some have even gone straight to another shop and ran it on their dyno and made a much higher number but this forum was not for the dyno or dyno number as much as id love it if the 5.7 came with 350 wheel and 400 torque stock but in all honesty my dad’s 5.7 bone stock 17’ shaker challenger is nowhere close to 350 wheel and would probably get beat by a altima if the nissan wanted it bad enough but the charger is lacking several bolt on parts that the 6.1 and 6.4 come with stock but its still making equal if not more power even if we say the 5.7 has 300 wheel stock i still have 50 more from somewhere internally especially showing all stock external parts
Ok, I realize you're 17, but dude, seriously. Punctuation is your friend and mine. I got freaking Tourrete's trying to read that.

Now, I have no clue where you got your stock HP levels from but you're waaaay off. A bone stock 6.4 puts 420-430 to the wheels. That's why I said you're not beating them at your power level. It just ain't happening.

I'm no bench racer, I actually race and have for way longer than you've been alive lol. I know BS when I see it.

Your car isn't revving past 8k RPMs. That dyno sheet says TIME, not RPM's. That means that dyno pull took over 8 seconds not that it revved over 8k RPM's.

Take another look at my sheet and notice it says RPM's where yours says time.

I'm not calling you a liar dude. Someone has lied to you and I'm trying to show you the truth.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Ok, I realize you're 17, but dude, seriously. Punctuation is your friend and mine. I got freaking Tourrete's trying to read that.

Now, I have no clue where you got your stock HP levels from but you're waaaay off. A bone stock 6.4 puts 420-430 to the wheels. That's why I said you're not beating them at your power level. It just ain't happening.

I'm no bench racer, I actually race and have for way longer than you've been alive lol. I know BS when I see it.

Your car isn't revving past 8k RPMs. That dyno sheet says TIME, not RPM's. That means that dyno pull took over 8 seconds not that it revved over 8k RPM's.

Take another look at my sheet and notice it says RPM's where yours says time.

I'm not calling you a liar dude. Someone has lied to you and I'm trying to show you the truth.
you’re looking at it the wrong way i wasn’t buying it as a hellcat it was just a 5000$ first car that i planned on making fast on day because getting the challenger is a far fetch

the previous owner got the car from the guy who had done everything to it so he was completely clueless just said “i drove it to nc from texas and its got some cooling issues and its not stock” and to be fair i thought he was bs for months until i fixed all the coolant leaks and everything then started trying to do some pulls and it kept exceeding expectations this guy with a 06 5.7 charger had a 6.1 stoker kit put in it and after i beat him hes the one that told me to start looking for what was done to the car

and you’re right im off on the 6.4 numbers someone must have had a blown head gasket or something on the forum i saw but im probably alot closer to srt8 stock numbers but definitely higher than 5.7 numbers and with headers and intake i might be making stock hp of a 50k car or pretty close to it

i just need a little bit more to get over the hump, id love 500-550 wheel but that’ll be the next block probably if i can get this one to 450-475 wheel i think ill be good to go for a while also my bad for seeming clueless i know y’all are the ones who have alot more knowledge on this stuff im just starting out and if i had other people to ask id ask them my family thinks cars are just for point A to point B and all my friends think you just make power by throwing an ebay turbo on their car so i don’t have many mechanically intelligent people around

but the people at the tune shop were definitely trying to take advantage of me every step and i guess they couldn’t even show me the right graph either

honestly i never really thought the car got revved out until 8k until last week i happened to go back and look at the dyno video and was just confused at the drop off and the number 8 below it and assumed it was the rpms because the car really does feel all top end and feels like it has more hidden power up top even if i only went to 6200-6500 but right now the pull it feels chopped off at 6 maybe a 6.1 pcm might need to be in my future but what mods do you recommend next to keep packing on top end power and do you recommend a ported 6.1 intake or the edelbrock victor 2

my thought process right now is pretty much try intake and headers and see how it feels, if it doesn’t feel noticeably different i’ll probably do an entire overhaul and get new forged bottom end bored to either 410,396,392 , ported heads, new valvetrain, probably stage 3 tsp or custom grind ,and 3.09 srt8 lsd rear cradle with the diff,driveshaft,axels but i’ll figure out that parts list when i need it

do you know if the eagle 5.7s have any issues with getting tuned because the next time i get a tune i want to make sure that almost all of the tables have been adjusted and there is some actual newfound power and everything i don’t want them to just change a/f ratio do a wot pull then send the car out if hptuners isn’t capable of it would a standalone ecu like holley dominator or something help me out or is it just an issue of finding a good reliable tuner that doesn’t just want your money

also my bad i probably should have mentioned ive been paying for all this with my job not my pops i know this was probably starting to look like a too spoiled situation
 

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have a good one i don’t know what the point of lying would be theres no ego in it its a old ass car but i can’t help what it does the point of the thread is to figure out what’s done to it because its not stock isn’t stock hp on a 5.7 270-290 wheel and 6.4 is 330-360 wheel stock so i show 60-70 more wheel than stock eagle 5.7 and almost stock 6.4 numbers without the torque that 6.4 intake and manifold adds while im at 170k miles and there are many forums that show these numbers and have sheets to prove im not trying to act like i have the fastest thing ever but something inside this car isn’t how it came from factory and was just looking for advice if this isn’t for you leave it for someone else to comment
Stock eagle 5.7s are around 320-335whp. I am not sure where you are getting your info from, but it needs some tweaking.
I think it is great that you are young and wanting to modify your V8 muscle car to make it fast, when other kids your age just want to be the next Tik Tok star.

Your first action should be to find out how fast it is. Dynos are a tuning tool. Yes they can tell you how much power your car makes, but the numbers can be easily manipulated.
Take your car to the local track for a test and tune night. I would be surprised if your car would be any faster than high 13s(nothing wrong with that number). High 13s is still a fast car.
Once you have a proper baseline, then you can worry about modifying your car to how you want it and others can give you better advice to get you where you want to go.

If you car has the stock manifolds, I doubt it has had many modifications, since the first thing most people do for power modifications is a set of long tube headers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Stock eagle 5.7s are around 320-335whp. I am not sure where you are getting your info from, but it needs some tweaking.
I think it is great that you are young and wanting to modify your V8 muscle car to make it fast, when other kids your age just want to be the next Tik Tok star.

Your first action should be to find out how fast it is. Dynos are a tuning tool. Yes they can tell you how much power your car makes, but the numbers can be easily manipulated.
Take your car to the local track for a test and tune night. I would be surprised if your car would be any faster than high 13s(nothing wrong with that number). High 13s is still a fast car.
Once you have a proper baseline, then you can worry about modifying your car to how you want it and others can give you better advice to get you where you want to go.

If you car has the stock manifolds, I doubt it has had many modifications, since the first thing most people do for power modifications is a set of long tube headers.
it had pick and pull intake and 5.7 truck headers thrown on it before i bought it but november the headers say they’ll finally come in the mail but once i get those on i want to probably get new rear axles and driveshaft then take it to the local strip a couple towns over its only like 20$ every friday for test and tune but i appreciate all the advice and everything i’ve been wanting to take it to the track or something for a while but school and work have had me tied up the best ive had is some nice highway pulls in mexico but usually whenever i race its only scat packs it just walks past 5.7s even with the 8 speed thats why i haven’t really thought much on the dyno but ill be able to tell alot more from a 1/4 time than a 5th gear dyno pull
 
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