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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Backstory:
So recently (2 Months ago) I bought an 06 RT from my older brother (Mechanic. Owns a cylinder had repair shop that also does engine rebuilds) for $2,500 with the mileage being at about 140k and with the body/interior being in great condition (no scratches,dents or fading whatsoever). He has always taken good care of his cars and I’ve never seen any of his cars go bad. Before he sold me the car he told me he...
  • Resurfaced Cylinder Head (No Valve Seating Issue)
  • Replaced Radiator
  • Replace Brake Pads/Rotors
  • Replaced Spark Plugs
  • Oil Change
  • New tires
A week before the actual problem begins:
One night I was driving and I suddenly heard a noise from the engine and didn’t think much of it. I drove for about 1-2 minutes @25-30mph before I stopped at the gas station for gas and I started to see smoke rising from the hood and so I check it out and my radiator hose had magically popped out of place and spilled ALL the water causing it to steam when it hit the HOT (gauge didn’t show any overheating) engine. I immediately called my brother and he filled it with water (water was boiling) and let the engine cool down before taking it to his shop so he can take all the air out. That same night he checked for oil leaks and made sure it was full still (I was there). Got the car back a day later and he said everything was fine, no harm was done.

Problem has begun:
Exactly a week later
. I was coming back down from the mountains and when I was almost home I noticed my oil light turning on and off for a couple seconds and then completely turned off for a couple of minutes and it would do the same thing again. About 20 minutes go by and I hit a red light and I feel my steering getting very hard to turn and my car wasn’t moving anymore, stalled. Moved it out of traffic and came to realize the car was completely EMPTY on oil. So I filled her with oil and the car actually turned on but made a knocking noise and so I didn’t drive it till my brother took a look at it.

Diagnostics:
My brother took the engine apart and well these are my pistons.
First 4 Pistons
291136

Other 4 Pistons
291134

Now here comes the culprit (According to my brother) that started all this mess.
291137

He said that this thing (he called it something I just can’t remember) failed on me and that as soon as I saw the oil light flash I should have pulled over immediately. He’s offering to rebuild my engine and just charge me for parts. Price estimate of $1,500-$2,000 (No Big Deal). Now let’s say I do this Rebuild, he gave me 2 options for the part that failed. He said either we get a delete kit that will prevent this from happening again (told me about flashing the computer also if I choose this route) or just replace them with oems.

Concerns:
My father is very skeptical on the situation since the day my radiator hose came off. He believes the car must of had an underlying issue before my brother sold it to me (whether my brother knew it or not) and does not want me to risk this (risk? The risk of the car breaking down way sooner than my brother has been telling us which he said would be years from now with good maintance). I’m no car expert and would very much appreciate the thoughts of other people that have experience with these 06 RT Engines.

Car itself:
291138

Probably the ugliest picture I have atm.
 

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Looks like you had a valve seat drop, shatter, then hammer the crap out of that piston. The part you show is the MDS solenoid (multiple displacement system)..for $1550 in parts, have him rebuild it with a Non-MDS cam from a Challenger manual transmission car..it should run for years after a good rebuild, just like he says.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Just spoke to my brother and asked if the valve seat had dropped when the MDS Solenoid failed and he said "no they didnt drop but since I will be redoing your cylinder head again, the valve seats will be new again". "Again" referring to the time he resurfaced my cylinder head before he sold me the car. Is it possible that the valve seats didnt drop and the mds solenoid failed causing all these problems? Also am I able to delete the MDS and keep the same cam? I haven't decided on whether to spend extra money on a non-MDS cam.

Edit: I'm heavily leaning towards on deleting the MDS so I don't have this issue in the future...
 

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RC:
Welcome to the forum. Your Charger looks like a nice example of the first year (2006) of the Gen 1 4 door Chargers. If the inside is as nice as the outside, I vote to save it if you can.

The '06 Charger Hemis are well known for dropping valve seats. Sometimes early in their life, and sometimes much later. Some folks reported that it occurred after the engine had overheated, while others said they had been driving, stopped for fuel or other short errand, and then upon restarting heard terrible noises and rough running without prior warning.

It would be VERY unusual for all 4 MDS solenoids to fail at once. As you can see, two are one side of the engine, and two on the other. The usual failure mode has been rough running, and a CE light. As long as the engine is not driven for a long time in this condition, there is usually no permanent damage.

You say that all 4 pistons on one side are damaged. If you Google/research Hemi Charger valve seat issue, you will see many pics that look just like the damaged ones you have. While it could have happened at any time, the overheating you reported did not help things, and may have started the down hill slide to one or more seats dropping on that one head, and the result is what you now see. As to the oil being gone, it usually results in a spun bearing(s), eventual knock,and then a seized engine. Looking at the one piston, I am surprised that the associated cylinder(s) are not so marred/scored that the block is a total loss as well.

Given what has happened, if I were doing it, I would want both heads either reconditioned or replaced so that there would be no more valve seat worries. If he can do it "right" for an amount you can live with, by all means forge ahead. Bear in mind that with 140K on the clock, other things like the trans/rearend, etc could crop up next, so you'll want to factor that possibility into your decision.

Good luck!

Don
 

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Discussion Starter #5
RC:
Welcome to the forum. Your Charger looks like a nice example of the first year (2006) of the Gen 1 4 door Chargers. If the inside is as nice as the outside, I vote to save it if you can.

The '06 Charger Hemis are well known for dropping valve seats. Sometimes early in their life, and sometimes much later. Some folks reported that it occurred after the engine had overheated, while others said they had been driving, stopped for fuel or other short errand, and then upon restarting heard terrible noises and rough running without prior warning.

It would be VERY unusual for all 4 MDS solenoids to fail at once. As you can see, two are one side of the engine, and two on the other. The usual failure mode has been rough running, and a CE light. As long as the engine is not driven for a long time in this condition, there is usually no permanent damage.

You say that all 4 pistons on one side are damaged. If you Google/research Hemi Charger valve seat issue, you will see many pics that look just like the damaged ones you have. While it could have happened at any time, the overheating you reported did not help things, and may have started the down hill slide to one or more seats dropping on that one head, and the result is what you now see. As to the oil being gone, it usually results in a spun bearing(s), eventual knock,and then a seized engine. Looking at the one piston, I am surprised that the associated cylinder(s) are not so marred/scored that the block is a total loss as well.

Given what has happened, if I were doing it, I would want both heads either reconditioned or replaced so that there would be no more valve seat worries. If he can do it "right" for an amount you can live with, by all means forge ahead. Bear in mind that with 140K on the clock, other things like the trans/rearend, etc could crop up next, so you'll want to factor that possibility into your decision.

Good luck!

Don
He said only one solenoid (the one circled in the picture was broken and the rest weren’t) failed thus causing this in the first place. If all 4 solenoids failing would be the ideal situation for this type of problem to occur then this makes me question his honesty on the issue. Either way he did say he will redo the heads.

Any opinions on deleting the MDS (of course replacing lifters with non mds ones)? Keep same cam or just grab a non mds one? Trying to justify the reason of buying a non mds cam.
 

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RC:
I want to state that I am not accusing your brother of being dishonest. As adults, we have all had different experiences. Some here have had formal automotive training, and others (myself included) have not.

With only one solenoid going bad, I would expect the damage to be limited to that cylinder. I don't see how the other 3 on that bank could have damage, as two of them do not have MDS, and the damage does resemble what happens when valve seats drop.

I imagine you will want to weigh keeping the oem cam along with replacing all 4 solenoids versus a new non MDS cam, no new solenoids, and a tune to keep the PCM from expecting to see the MDS system working. With no sort of warranty being involved, no worry there. A different cam would probably grant you some extra HP. Whether such an upgrade would require a tune I can't say.

Don
 
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