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SRT AWD 8 Speed -Chicago Show??

17K views 84 replies 16 participants last post by  MCaesar 
#1 ·
Ok I heard this is getting announced in Chicago next week!!!!!!!

Well, maybe if I generate enough rumor buzz it may actually happen some how heh..Sorry that sux I know, Im bored. I have checkbook in hand and am waiting for an 8 speed behind something with some balls. Sorry no jeeps either (but they're cool).

May have to defer to 5.7 RT Max with 8 speed and AWD Sport (assuming there will be one)...Love the blacked out grill on the AWD Sport. Ive been waiting for 18 months and am sick of it.

Im getting a new car this year and better damn well not be a Taurus SHO.. Where the hell is my HEMI 8 Speed AWD!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sincerely,
Patience Nohmore
 
#7 ·
You're holding out for the 8-speed? You will seriously go with an SHO over an SRT8 because of the availability of transmission gears?

The more people that talk smack about the 5-speed end up being people who haven't driven it and just repeat what they've heard others say.

I guess the '13 Vanquish is off your list too then. Even Jay Leno admits it doesn't need more than 6.

 
#10 ·
You're holding out for the 8-speed? You will seriously go with an SHO over an SRT8 because of the availability of transmission gears?

The more people that talk smack about the 5-speed end up being people who haven't driven it and just repeat what they've heard others say.

I guess the '13 Vanquish is off your list too then. Even Jay Leno admits it doesn't need more than 6.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z57FtTJi_-U
The Vanquish transmission in infamously bad compared to the competition. The transmission in the One-77 was so bad that they tried to keep magazines from testing one. One finally was able to test one and quickly realized why Aston kept the press away from it. So, I probably wouldn't use Aston-Martin as a company too look up towards when it comes to transmissions. Lamborghini is similarly bad. If you want a good transmission; look at Ferrari, Porsche, McLaren, or the Nissan GT-R. Of course, I don't know what exotic transmissions have to do with the SRT8.

What would rock would be a twin-clutch, but I doubt that Dodge can source one at a reasonable cost that will handle the torque. I don't see customers willing to pay $8K extra for the transmission like on a Porsche PDK.
 
#8 ·
That Vanquish is one sweet ride!!!
 
#9 ·
Why should I be expected to drop 50+ large and settle for that ancient 5 speed tranny, when I know that a quality ZF-based 8 speed is right around the corner?

Im not going to be a victim of Dodge's laziness (or crappy Daimler 5 speed contract) forever. Get it done already.
 
#14 ·
From a different discussion thread:

The 8 speed doesn't have a fill tube, just a check hole in the side. The trans filter/pan assembly is $309.00 at the dealership and the fluid is $41.00 per quart and it takes 9.5 quarts. So, a trans service for just the pan and fluid is going to be $698.50 + service charge. 5 speed is 48.00 + $68.00 + 150.00 service charge. BIG DIFFERENCE in service price.

Regards,
Brian
 
#16 ·
For Ram production too. From Ralph's Twitter:

@RalphGilles said:
“@TheRoundWheel:When will the V8 Chargers and 300s come with an 8 speed?” it will be a while 8 speed capacity is currently routed to Ram/GC
You can always spend $10k to $20k or more and get an Audi S or RS. Funny how people want a new RWD / AWD 500+HP sedan for $35k, and then complain when it doesn't magically appear, or complain about the cost-cutting to get it to that price point.
 
#17 ·
realistically, it makes sense.....

last year, dodge sold over 200k ram 1500's and over 150k GC last year, and they sold combined about 160k 300's and chargers....assume the take-rate of the V8's is 50% in the cars, that's about 80K vehicles (I bet it's more like 30%, so ~50k vehicles)....V8's in rams are probably 95%, with at least half being the 5.7L....V8's in the cherokees is probably about 50% as well...which is going to have the bigger impact on CAFE? selling 150K+ trucks/SUV's with the 8 speed, or 50-80k cars?
 
#18 ·
I never said I was only willing to pay 35k..Im not willing to spend 50+k on that ancient POS 5 speed Daimler junk. Every rag had said the same thing, its a POS. Im not going to wait forever and I don't want t damn SUV or truck to SRT around in..

I have CHECKBOOK IN HAND and have been waiting almost 2 years for something to happen.
 
#19 ·
Magazine racer. Gotcha. Funny how every, single, 2nd Gen SRT8 owner seems to be living just fine with the 5-spd. Of course, perhaps we're all just idiots for buying it, right?

You're going to be waiting even longer. In the meantine, continue to ask for things that aren't offered, act like you're being cheated by not being offered exactly what you want in the exact way you want it (but instead being treated exactly like any other customer) and continue to act like your individual business is worth completely changing their business model. Because SRT will be terrified of the thought of not getting your business and do anything you ask as if their lives depended on it.

You're drastically overestimating the amount of leverage your prospective purchase gives you. Kind of like the the type of person who doesn't pay their bill since signing up and then demands months of free service for being put on hold when calling customer service.
 
#20 ·
Heh and youre the type of person that races out and buys a Droid phone (like every one else) and just assumes its normal to be rebooted three times a day, since you don't know any better gotcha. if youre happy with it that's all that counts. don't tell me what I should want however.
 
#21 ·
Assumptions are fun. I have a two-year old Samsung Galaxy S2 that recently got upgraded to 4.1.2, is rock solid, and has never crashed nor needed a reboot. It also connects seamlessly with my car every time I get in, despite the 19th century transmission's presence. Prior to that, I had a 3-year old Blackberry. Any other swipes at my credibility? My sexual orientation perhaps (hint: married, with kids, white picket fence, transmission named Nag)? Wanna compare investment portfolios to see whos' is bigger? Homies to see whos' is cooler?

I am happy with the old phone, and the current SRT8, and the stone-age transmission, and that's what counts. I have no more business telling you what you want than you telling SRT what to sell. That's my point, and you continue to miss it. Unlike gear changes in my Jurassic transmission, which have yet to have a miss.

Your thread started out ok, but you lost any credibility when you started talking smack about Chargers on... a Charger forum. Shocking and unexpected, I know.

Take care, have fun, added to the ignore list. :beerchug:
 
#23 ·
The torque of the 392 definitely made up for the spread in ratios of the 5speed. I liked the 5speed in my 6.1, but an 8speed would have been awesome.

IF Chrysler sources an 8speed auto for the 392 AND IF they make the ratios more aggressive than the 5speed, it could obsolete those cars pretty quickly.
 
#27 ·
The torque of the 392 definitely made up for the spread in ratios of the 5speed. I liked the 5speed in my 6.1, but an 8speed would have been awesome.

IF Chrysler sources an 8speed auto for the 392 AND IF they make the ratios more aggressive than the 5speed, it could obsolete those cars pretty quickly.
Well said
 
#25 ·
The new 8-speed keeps the 6.4L HEMI engine in the heart of its power band, says Roselli. "When we do 50-75 mph passing, the mode that also comes into play while merging on an expressway, the 5-speed car did it in 4.7 seconds the 8-speed does it in 3.9. When you go on road trips and you end up on two-lane highways, passing cars can be accomplished with ridiculous ease. Your exposure in the oncoming lane is nothing when you have that kind of performance."

:driving:

OY
 
#26 ·
Yeah I think some people (mostly the people who just bought a SRT8 with a 5-spd) underestimate the performance gains of a good transmission. I owned a SRT8 and I have driven a newer SRT8 and the transmission is weak. My '94 BMW 540i had a much better transmission that was super intelligent when in sport mode versus my old SRT8. The SRT8 was fine when I manually shifted it, but the built in shifting logic was just absurdly bad. Even with clearing out the TCM memory, it was still very slow.

Go drive a Nissan GT-R if you want to see a GOOD transmission. Granted that car costs twice as much...but it shifts fast! 0-60 in 2.7 seconds if fun. :driving:
 
#31 ·
If you're really in need of the features of an S6, for "around" the cost of a new SRT8, you can always look for a used one... ;)

2010 Audi S6
 
#35 ·
If you're really in need of the features of an S6, for "around" the cost of a new SRT8, you can always look for a used one... ;)
Not a bad thought. Although the V8TT with the 7speed DCT is an entirely different animal, and much quicker, than the V10 6auto

Keep an eye on the upcoming Maserati Ghibli, that car is going to be an outright animal. Twin turbo Ferrari V8 power, 200+ MPH, AWD is also very likely as the Quattroporte has it. Its coming to kick sand in the face of the M5 and E63..and the best part is the next Charger will use the same platform.

Speaking of Audis, I was looking at the RS5 the other day and had to laugh. The car weighs 4300lbs and only makes 316 lbft of torque. Yeah, it has 450 HP too....which it makes at a truly ridiculous 8250 RPM. Talk about useless lol
The current Quattroporte has that, and its quick, but not a M5/E63 killer, more of a competitor. E63 is now AWD so that will be pretty cool.

I wouldn't knock the RS5, that is a wonderful powertrain and in the R8 sounds fantastic. I don't believe it weighs 4500, more like 4000.

As much as people hate it, I still look at Car & Driver for info like this

In their tests, they have

SRT8 13.0
RS5 12.8
Super Bee 12.6

I am sure the RS5 will be quickest off the line with AWD but after that the Super Bee will pass it and I bet on a roll so would the SRT8

The AWD from a dig is got to be worth 0.2-0.5 seconds

RS5

C/D TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 4.4 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 10.4 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 18.5 sec
Street start, 5–60 mph: 5.0 sec
Top gear, 30–50 mph: 2.5 sec
Top gear, 50–70 mph: 3.2 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.8 @ 111 mph
Top speed (governor limited): 178 mph
Braking, 70–0 mph: 158 ft
Roadholding, 200-ft-dia skidpad: 0.96 g

FUEL ECONOMY:
EPA city/highway: 16/23 mpg
C/D observed: 16 mpg


Super Bee

C/D TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 4.2 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 9.8 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 16.8 sec
Rolling start, 5–60 mph: 4.4 sec
Top gear, 30–50 mph: 2.4 sec
Top gear, 50–70 mph: 2.7 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.6 sec @ 115 mph
Top speed (drag limited): 178 mph
Braking, 70–0 mph: 165 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.86 g

FUEL ECONOMY:
EPA city/highway driving: 14/23 mpg
C/D observed: 17 mpg
Agreed however making up a 4mph delta from a roll might take a lot of real estate... ;)

The RS5 with launch control and it's gearing could be a consistent sub-4.0 as well.
Also believe 115mph is the absolute best-ever for a 6.4 and 111mph has a little room for the RS5..
 
#32 ·
Keep an eye on the upcoming Maserati Ghibli, that car is going to be an outright animal. Twin turbo Ferrari V8 power, 200+ MPH, AWD is also very likely as the Quattroporte has it. Its coming to kick sand in the face of the M5 and E63..and the best part is the next Charger will use the same platform.

Speaking of Audis, I was looking at the RS5 the other day and had to laugh. The car weighs 4300lbs and only makes 316 lbft of torque. Yeah, it has 450 HP too....which it makes at a truly ridiculous 8250 RPM. Talk about useless lol
 
#37 · (Edited)
I got my 0-60 in 4.0 seconds from Motor Trend. I agree with Deuuce that you are picking the absolute quickest 6.4L SRT8 I've seen out there. It also seems to not be a good example of "real" performance numbers but one outside the norm. I also agree that the RS5 will be much easier to repeat numbers day to day, while it would take a VERY good launch to hit those SRT8 numbers. I would say they are possible, much like a person doing 11.7 in a stock C5Z, but outside the norm.

Either way, my point is that the RS5 is not a car anyone should be laughing at. It is plenty quick and beats the SRT8 in almost every performance category (which your post displays). If the only thing you care about is straight line acceleration, then the SRT8 is a great and cheap choice....but look at the handling and braking differences. They are HUGE. I don't think anyone would dispute which would win on a road coarse.

Would I buy a new RS5? Probably not. Too expensive for the overall performance. But it isn't a car I would "laugh" at. It is a car I admire, but not necessarily want to pay for. Other cars in this category- Aston Martin, Audi R8 V8, BMW M5, & Maserati.


And BTW, the Quattroporte is based on the current 300 platform and will come with a twin turbo Ferrari V8 or a twin-turbo variant of the Pentastar V6. Ready for the awesome performance numbers of the V8 version? 0-60 in 4.7 seconds. The Pentastar version does 0-60 in 5.1 seconds. And you don't want to own one of these the second it gets out of warranty. Go look at the price of any modern used Maserati out of warranty....they are worth almost nothing. Maintenance is just too expensive on a not so awesome car.

Here is a 2003 Convertible with just 50K miles that could be had for less than the price of a '06 SRT8- http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...[]]&listingId=339234815&listingIndex=55&Log=0

Any Audi S6/7 (0-60 in 3.7 seconds) will also absolutely DESTROY the Maserati and cost much less. The Quattroporte will probably cost $135K+ with the V8. I honestly don't think Audi, BMW or Mercedes have much to fear.
 
#38 ·
No way would I laugh at it either

And I would expect to lose from a dig or on a road course

I also would expect to win from a roll. So it comes down to what you like.

I am an interstate cruiser so I love cars with lots of room and top end power
 
#39 ·
Edited my prior post to add some information on the forthcoming Maserati Quattroporte.

And I agree with you that it comes down to what you like. I love the SRT8 for what it is. I decided in the end it wasn't the right car for me at this time. Would I still love to own my old car? Yes. Do I miss that special car? Yes.

To me the perfect car for you is an AMG Mercedes. Much higher quality car than a Charger, and it has great straight line performance. It is a German muscle car. I have a friend who has similar wants to you, other than the need for passenger space, and he owns a Viper Copperhead convertible (over 700 NA HP modified and I think this is the same color as Charger GoMango) and a Nissan GT-R (he just started modifying this and plans for 650+ HP). And honestly I would be more scared of the GT-R beating my Vette than the Viper. The GT-R (like the RS5) is just easier to drive and makes performance runs easily repeatable. The Viper is a handfull and traction limited. My car actually hangs with his Viper pretty well, but I think his tune is off at the moment. The (at the time) stock GT-R was brutally quick at a launch, and he would KILL my Vette unless I got things perfect.
 
#42 ·
Twin clutch transmissions could very well be a passing trend. If you look at what cars they are trying to put these in on a mass scale they aren't being appreciated at all (Ford Focus, Dodge Dart, various VW's), which is sad, but then again - what makes the TC good are really only 2 reasons. #1 lightning quick shifts and #2 efficiency over a hydraulic factory, torque converter using automatic. (old automatics, and simply old thinking)

The ZF 8-speed in particular shifts just as fast as a TC and is just as efficient, so is the coming 9-speed from them for the Chrysler FWD cars. Good review on the ZF 8-speed (in the 135i) here from one of the very rare noteworthy reviewers today http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2xwecTp91-o

I've driven TC cars at length, and while I thought it was cool to go through the gears and feel the clutches engage / disengage in normal driving, while also feeling the rear calipers electronically clamp to hold the car at stop lights + hill hold assist to launch away from a hill-stop, the normal driver certainly does not! Just go read any review.

GM has their own 8-speed auto they are working on and I am certain thats all you'll see in the vette in lieu of their 7-speed manual.
 
#46 ·
To all of this I read - I could of bought RS5 or AMG merc here in Europe, but chose to hunt down Charger SRT8 2012 from US. For me, most german cars are kind of plain. I have owned BMW and driven Audis, but still would go with 5-speed Charger SRT.
yea, the charger is a big girl over here (in germany too). i definately get a lot of looks/glances when i pass by - especially if i make her "purr" :) and not the bad kind (of looks) lol
 
#48 ·
Wouldn't matter if 5th and 8th are the same ratio. If the engine or drivability cannot sustain a higher ratio, then the final ratio will remain unchanged.

The 8speeds and upcoming 9speeds are stepped with multiple ODs but the top gear isn't going to change in ratio unless something else changes.
 
#51 · (Edited)
Grim, I dont race magazines. The RS5 weighs the same as an SRT8 and needs to be wound up to 8250 RPM to make its 450 HP. How often are you even at 6000 RPM on the street? That 0-60 test was probably launched while bouncing off the rev limiter.

Say what you will, 316lbft of torque in a 4200lb car is pathetic, you guys complain about 420 in the 6.1L...this has 100 less. The car would be a pig unless absolutely wound out (and getting 6 MPG doing so). Unimpressed.

The new Quattroporte doesn't use a "current" Chrysler 300 platform either, it uses the first variation of the next gen RWD platform that will eventually underpin the next gen Charger and 300. Go back to your data numbers and compare its weight to an S63 AMG (its competitor, its not an E-seg car anymore, its 207" long)....you'll know then because its 900lbs lighter.
 
#53 ·
Grim, I dont race magazines. The RS5 weighs the same as an SRT8 and needs to be wound up to 8250 RPM to make its 450 HP. How often are you even at 6000 RPM on the street? That 0-60 test was probably launched while bouncing off the rev limiter.

Say what you will, 316lbft of torque in a 4200lb car is pathetic, you guys complain about 420 in the 6.1L...this has 100 less. The car would be a pig unless absolutely would out (and getting 6 MPG doing so). Unimpressed.

The new Quattroporte doesn't use a "current" Chrysler 300 platform either, it uses the first variation of the next gen RWD platform that will eventually underpin the next gen Charger and 300. Go back to your data numbers and compare its weight to an S63 AMG (its competitor, its not an E-seg car anymore, its 207" long)....you'll know then because its 900lbs lighter.
Well the RS5 does beat the SRT8 in almost every performance area. On top of that, with AWD it will be far easier to launch than a SRT8 which is under-tired for the torque. I know you say you don't race magazines...in the real world the RS5 will win 9 out of 10 stoplight races and beat the SRT8 in every other performance area. The RS5 is a great grand touring car. Honestly, the SRT8 shouldn't be compared, the RS5 is FAR more car.

And I am unimpressed with Maserati. They are common as heck in my area as soccer mom cars. Maseratis are the type of car you want to give to your worst enemy right out of warranty when they are worth little and maintenance is a *****. I would much rather have a more common Mercedes, Porsche or Audi. And all the Maserati competition will destroy the Quattroporte performance-wise.
 
#55 · (Edited)
Audi is not vastly superior; it's hype maintained by people that don't know any better. They're expensive Volkswagens. I was all over the S5 and RS5 until I sat in them and drove them; while the material and fit and finish is marginally better, it's not thousands of dollars better. The 2011/12 Chrysler products have made a huge leap forward from the 1st gens and are every bit as good as they should be at the price point.

Your argument for the S5 and S6 got shot down, so naturally you move to the RS5. It had better have better performance than an SRT8; it costs a helluva lot more.

What is it with people who talk smack about the SRT8s, the 5-speed and the overall quality in general if the point of comparison is a car they own that is several years older, or they start comparing to BMW, Audi, Merc, etc. Funny how there's three kinds of people in this thread; 2nd gen SRT8 owners who are happy and can respect the 1st gens, 1st gen owners who are happy with their cars and respectful of the 2nd gen, and bitter people who have nothing constructive to add other than "the 2nd gen sucks, the 5spd sucks, the fit and finish sucks, SRT sucks, Ralph's an idiot, I could make better decisions, it's not expensive enough, it doesn't have option X, it doesn't polish my privates like a Merc".

THE SRT8 IS AT A LOWER PRICE POINT FOR A REASON. If you want to pay $65+k for a car, go knock yourselves out; buy a E63, and be done with it.
 
#56 ·
X2!

A new Audi compared to an 06-10 Charger, well yeah, not even on the same planet...but a NEW one, they've "closed the gap" considerably in that department. Audis are also ALL (besides the R8) flipped around FWD layout platforms with AWD added as an afterthought. People get fooled because they place the engine in a North-South arrangement but they are just as FWD as a North-South engined 300M or LHS.

Then you have their "quality"....yeah right. Buddy of mine just dumped his 05 S4, neat car at first when he bought it, but WEIRD things began happening at an alarming rate, ice coming out of the A/C vents was my personal favorite. $600 AC compressor or some other crazy expensive part to fix that, it had some deep rooted electrical short somewhere that kept the DS rear tail light, blinker and running light dim back there. Had it diagnosed multiple times, had correct volts, nobody knew why it did it. A few times we'd hop in and he'd go to start it and nothing, dash and all lights would turn on but no ignition, then he'd have to sit there and play with the key. Tons of little crap like that, Audi IS NOT a quality automobile.

He traded it on a new Genesis Coupe last year with the Ice problem happening and the dash lit up like a Christmas tree (check engine, airbag, coolant, stupid rear light warning and something else) and says he'd never own one again. I was there when he bought it too, it was a Cherry 1 owner right from Audi when it was just 3 years old.
 
#62 ·
A few points:

* People poo poo magazine times but they are very useful at showing a picture if you understand the constraints

* AWD cars with the same 1/4 mile time as a powerful RWD car will get beaten on a roll when the 2 race. The performance Audis usually clock about 0.3 seconds faster in the 1/4 than equally powered RWD competition. Notice the S8 beats the M5, E63 (which is now going to AWD) and CTS-V

* Price point - what car gives you the room and power of the SRT8 for under $50K?
 
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