Not a big fan of the GT-R though obviously I respect its performance capabilities.
1. Styling is plain ugly to me - not sexy at all
2. It almost takes the driver out of the equation. It is the new Porsche 959 where it is so good you have to be a complete idiot to mess up. There is less talent involved in driving one fast than a Viper or ZR1
I love the AMG line - especially the big ones. And the new AWD E63 might just be perfect IF it has enough back seat room. Otherwise I might lean towards the S8 - at least until the next generation S63 comes out.
Right now the S8 is faster and has AWD over the S63. Of course it also is nose heavy since Audis are converted FWD platforms.
For sports cars, I have a feeling the next Gen Vette will be another performance value
The Vette will be held back by the transmission choices. No twin clutch is really going to hurt them as more and more competitors are using them. Unless they do a fairly major running change, the Vette wont have a twin-clutch until 2020+. They said that they cannot fit a twin clutch in the current C7 due to size. I do love the styling of the new Vette (they seriously ripped of the Ferrari 599 styling). The rear end I am not sure about, but I don't hate it like many of the "old school" Vette guys do.
And have you driven a GT-R? I used to think I wouldn't like it, but it is very impressive to drive. 0-60 in 2.7 is no joke speed. I wouldn't buy one, but they are a really, really impressive car. And the car feels VERY light on it's feet- unlike the Vette, Viper or SRT8. The styling isn't great I would agree. I do think they look great from behind, but the other views are just ok (the opposite of a 6.1L Charger SRT8).
__________________ Grimlock
2003 Corvette Z06
2007 Charger SRT8 Gone, but not forgotten!
1969 Roadrunner in Red Gone, but not forgotten! <beep, beep>
Twin clutch transmissions could very well be a passing trend. If you look at what cars they are trying to put these in on a mass scale they aren't being appreciated at all (Ford Focus, Dodge Dart, various VW's), which is sad, but then again - what makes the TC good are really only 2 reasons. #1 lightning quick shifts and #2 efficiency over a hydraulic factory, torque converter using automatic. (old automatics, and simply old thinking)
The ZF 8-speed in particular shifts just as fast as a TC and is just as efficient, so is the coming 9-speed from them for the Chrysler FWD cars. Good review on the ZF 8-speed (in the 135i) here from one of the very rare noteworthy reviewers today http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=2xwecTp91-o
I've driven TC cars at length, and while I thought it was cool to go through the gears and feel the clutches engage / disengage in normal driving, while also feeling the rear calipers electronically clamp to hold the car at stop lights + hill hold assist to launch away from a hill-stop, the normal driver certainly does not! Just go read any review.
GM has their own 8-speed auto they are working on and I am certain thats all you'll see in the vette in lieu of their 7-speed manual.
Right now the S8 is faster and has AWD over the S63. Of course it also is nose heavy since Audis are converted FWD platforms.
For sports cars, I have a feeling the next Gen Vette will be another performance value
I believe none of the Audis are FWD based anymore except maybe the A3.
The issue now is the AWD adding front end weight.
Totally agree on the new C7.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboAWD
Twin clutch transmissions could very well be a passing trend. If you look at what cars they are trying to put these in on a mass scale they aren't being appreciated at all (Ford Focus, Dodge Dart, various VW's), which is sad, but then again - what makes the TC good are really only 2 reasons. #1 lightning quick shifts and #2 efficiency over a hydraulic factory, torque converter using automatic. (old automatics, and simply old thinking)
The ZF 8-speed in particular shifts just as fast as a TC and is just as efficient, so is the coming 9-speed from them for the Chrysler FWD cars. Good review on the ZF 8-speed (in the 135i) here from one of the very rare noteworthy reviewers today http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=2xwecTp91-o
I've driven TC cars at length, and while I thought it was cool to go through the gears and feel the clutches engage / disengage in normal driving, while also feeling the rear calipers electronically clamp to hold the car at stop lights + hill hold assist to launch away from a hill-stop, the normal driver certainly does not! Just go read any review.
GM has their own 8-speed auto they are working on and I am certain thats all you'll see in the vette in lieu of their 7-speed manual.
Agree on some points except the DCT is here to stay.
No sports car will go with an automatic only and autos cannot handle more than 8000rpm due to fluid physics anyway. It is unsuitable for the road circuit too.
Also, as AWD seems to be trending (E63) and with exotics with hybrid tech. (P1 & F150) and the insane gear ratios and power require a DCT.
Domestic sub-compact buyers are not keen on DCTs but VW has seen success and the automatic mode works well.
I'll be curious how the weight and complexity of a 9speed starts to compare to the DCT.
To all of this I read - I could of bought RS5 or AMG merc here in Europe, but chose to hunt down Charger SRT8 2012 from US. For me, most german cars are kind of plain. I have owned BMW and driven Audis, but still would go with 5-speed Charger SRT.
I believe none of the Audis are FWD based anymore except maybe the A3.
The issue now is the AWD adding front end weight.
Totally agree on the new C7.
Agree on some points except the DCT is here to stay.
No sports car will go with an automatic only and autos cannot handle more than 8000rpm due to fluid physics anyway. It is unsuitable for the road circuit too.
Also, as AWD seems to be trending (E63) and with exotics with hybrid tech. (P1 & F150) and the insane gear ratios and power require a DCT.
Domestic sub-compact buyers are not keen on DCTs but VW has seen success and the automatic mode works well.
I'll be curious how the weight and complexity of a 9speed starts to compare to the DCT.
On the high end they will likely stick around but I bet in a year or 2 it'll be nothing more than a distant memory in the Dodge Dart and possibly US bound Focus's.
About Audi they are all FWD based cars, the engine sits in a north-south arrangement (like the FWD Chrysler LH cars) but they are still FWD. They add AWD with a RWD torque bias and call it a day. All their platforms are derived from simple FWD VW's.
VW is a cash cow king right now because of this, platform R&D is what costs hundreds of millions and they use their VW platforms across the board right to Porsche in some cases (Toureg > Q7 > Cayenne, VW Bug > Audi TT etc etc.
Chrysler is going the same direction (hence the recent delay for new models) because the new platforms will start out at Maserati and Alfa Romeo and end up back at Dodge/Chrysler.
To all of this I read - I could of bought RS5 or AMG merc here in Europe, but chose to hunt down Charger SRT8 2012 from US. For me, most german cars are kind of plain. I have owned BMW and driven Audis, but still would go with 5-speed Charger SRT.
yea, the charger is a big girl over here (in germany too). i definately get a lot of looks/glances when i pass by - especially if i make her "purr" and not the bad kind (of looks) lol
__________________
Bryan - Kaiserslautern, Germany - Super Charged (8Lbs) Silver 2009 Charger SRT-8: ACES IV, QB Oil/trans/PS
I really wish my RT had a sixth gear overdrive because my gas mileage is sooo bad. Butter than my sisters truck tough. Lol
__________________
Maybe the youngest on the forums? 15 years old when I got my charger... Older now... 2007 Dodge Charger R/T AWD Daytona Grill...R/T Grill Emblem...Rear Spoiler...Danko Chin Spoiler...
I really wish my RT had a sixth gear overdrive because my gas mileage is sooo bad. Butter than my sisters truck tough. Lol
Wouldn't matter if 5th and 8th are the same ratio. If the engine or drivability cannot sustain a higher ratio, then the final ratio will remain unchanged.
The 8speeds and upcoming 9speeds are stepped with multiple ODs but the top gear isn't going to change in ratio unless something else changes.
The Vette will be held back by the transmission choices. No twin clutch is really going to hurt them as more and more competitors are using them. Unless they do a fairly major running change, the Vette wont have a twin-clutch until 2020+. They said that they cannot fit a twin clutch in the current C7 due to size. I do love the styling of the new Vette (they seriously ripped of the Ferrari 599 styling). The rear end I am not sure about, but I don't hate it like many of the "old school" Vette guys do.
And have you driven a GT-R? I used to think I wouldn't like it, but it is very impressive to drive. 0-60 in 2.7 is no joke speed. I wouldn't buy one, but they are a really, really impressive car. And the car feels VERY light on it's feet- unlike the Vette, Viper or SRT8. The styling isn't great I would agree. I do think they look great from behind, but the other views are just ok (the opposite of a 6.1L Charger SRT8).
It is ugly, not just ok in my book.
It looks too much like a fast and furious car rather than a high priced GT
Heck, even the old Supra was more attractive than this
From a standstill a Vette will never touch it - AWD vs. RWD
But on a roll a ZR1 will pull away (stock to stock)
As for the new Vette, it looked great until I saw the Camaro tailights on it!
__________________
2006 SRT8 175,000 miles+ (ordered with F1s and options)
If the govt was still calculating the unemployment rate using the same criteria, the “official” rate today would be closer to 18%. In 2004, median income man in his 30s - $35,010. Adj. for inflation, 12 percent less than 1974.
I believe none of the Audis are FWD based anymore except maybe the A3.
The issue now is the AWD adding front end weight.
Totally agree on the new C7.
Agree on some points except the DCT is here to stay.
No sports car will go with an automatic only and autos cannot handle more than 8000rpm due to fluid physics anyway. It is unsuitable for the road circuit too.
Also, as AWD seems to be trending (E63) and with exotics with hybrid tech. (P1 & F150) and the insane gear ratios and power require a DCT.
Domestic sub-compact buyers are not keen on DCTs but VW has seen success and the automatic mode works well.
I'll be curious how the weight and complexity of a 9speed starts to compare to the DCT.
They all are FWD based
Look at the weight distribution
__________________
2006 SRT8 175,000 miles+ (ordered with F1s and options)
If the govt was still calculating the unemployment rate using the same criteria, the “official” rate today would be closer to 18%. In 2004, median income man in his 30s - $35,010. Adj. for inflation, 12 percent less than 1974.
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and not the bad kind (of looks) lol
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