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  #51  
Old 11-26-2012, 11:18 AM
Moebius Moebius is offline
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For those of you who are still not convinced what oil to buy, go talk to your dealership, or better yet those who have actually turned wrenches for years.

Or go to your local machine shop and ask them what they think of boutique oils, if you think they will endorse it you'll be in for a shock :^)

The point is talk to anyone who does not have a vested interest (that means those honest folks-in-the-know out there who will not make money off you) in what oil type they would recommend and why...
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  #52  
Old 11-26-2012, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moebius View Post
For those of you who are still not convinced what oil to buy, go talk to your dealership, or better yet those who have actually turned wrenches for years.

Or go to your local machine shop and ask them what they think of boutique oils, if you think they will endorse it you'll be in for a shock :^)

The point is talk to anyone who does not have a vested interest (that means those honest folks-in-the-know out there who will not make money off you) in what oil type they would recommend and why...
All I see is YOUR OPINION. Not facts. If you are really into bashing BND. Then do a controlled experiment. I am sure an informed consumer like you would have the skill and knowlege to perform one.

Setup your experiment. Illustrate your experiment clearly to show how BND is boutique oil by solid testing facts. Do a good analysis and put them on a nice piece of paper. Then i am sure most people will agree with your statement.

So please, if you are into serious debate, get the experiment going. I am waiting.

Hey, people can judge for themselves. You really dont have to play the messiah here. If someone likes what they use, then leave them be.
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Last edited by xkm121; 11-26-2012 at 12:00 PM.
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  #53  
Old 11-26-2012, 12:13 PM
Moebius Moebius is offline
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If an end-user has no qualms about spending significantly more money after(!) getting properly educated - then great!

For those on the fence, or considering...then the suggestion of doing some investigation before spending all that dough would be prudent. I mean really...do you think all of us who have been breathing on engines for years, and have the same concerns for our powerplants would not be buying this if it actually worked?

In other words, where there is smoke...

Note I have never recommended any specific engine lubricant manufacturer. And if folks are (or were) not already aware of how subjective and controversial this topic is?

They are now.

I like to believe if folks actually balance the boutique oil claims against the reality(!) put forth by those with no vested interest who deal with engines every day in one way or another. Well...boutique oils would simply go away.

Kinda like those who have come to understand why a throttle body spacer on our rides is an expensive (and possibly noisy) paperweight that has no performance value what. so. ever. You know how the masses on this and other forums came to a universal understanding regarding TB spacers? Cause guys like me spoke out...

Last edited by Moebius; 11-26-2012 at 02:14 PM.
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  #54  
Old 11-26-2012, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by 370 HEMI View Post
Everything breaks eventually. You put too much stress on components that aren't designed for the overpower limits then that will happen. Our lubricants will protect where it is possible to see gains and to protect beyond what off the shelf oil will do given the same application! We have never had a failure due to our lubricants.....EVER. You are just talking to talk!

So you wouldn't do so on your 440...so what?

There are many people who have used our oils and found them to be much cleaner coming out of the engine at longer drain intervals than anything off the shelf. Fact.

They have done oil analysis and found our oils to reduce wear significantly compared to what they were buying. Fact

Again, your anecdotal statements without supporting data is opinion.

Give me an instance, show us pictures, put out evidence not just "don't buy a botique oil" nonsense!

There are just as many people who race and put serious pounding on their oils using our products as those who don't. Case in point:

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/...d.php?t=157324

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/...d.php?t=155876

You have made your opinon now move on!

Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
PM sent!
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  #55  
Old 11-26-2012, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moebius View Post
For those of you who are still not convinced what oil to buy, go talk to your dealership, or better yet those who have actually turned wrenches for years.

Really! Talk to the dealership!! Anyone who has dealt with them knows that very few of them know much about lubricants other than what their parts counter carries! They are no more experts on lubricants than a Walmart employee knows about how the Intel Processors map in the computers they sell.

Or go to your local machine shop and ask them what they think of boutique oils, if you think they will endorse it you'll be in for a shock :^)

Once again, machinists are into machining, align boring, head porting and combining the approprite parts to a customers requirements. They are not Tribologists! I have talked to many of them and have educated them about what they are seeing and why they see it. We have lots of machine shop engine builders that swear by our products now!

The point is talk to anyone who does not have a vested interest (that means those honest folks-in-the-know out there who will not make money off you) in what oil type they would recommend and why...
If you really want to know the truth, find someone who works in the oil industry to look at the oil analysis of different oils and then you will have an informed opinion. End users of machinery don't know what is in different blends and wouldn't know the difference between ZDP or ZnDDp. Neutral Phosphorous or Acidic Phosphorous. How much Magnesium to use safely or what Centipoise or Centistoke values should be. Just a really uninformed post you have here.

But the intent is to use ANYTHING but BND Automotive products! You would probably recommend sand before our oils.

Wow!

Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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  #56  
Old 11-27-2012, 09:35 AM
Moebius Moebius is offline
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The truth is BND engine oil is no better than anything else on the market. That's what those people who work on our vehicles will tell you. When you mention it will cost you nearly twice as much to use BND oil, they will laugh and shake their heads.

There are millions of vehicles around the world using off the shelf oil which have exerienced zero problems their entire service life. By far the majority of performance engines, race-prepped engines of any type as well use off the shelf engine oil. Most performance car owners know better than adding stuff just for the sake of adding stuff.

As more folks become educated as to what is really going on regarding those who peddle boutique oils, the hype backed up with all the gobbly-goop, the exaggerations and ten cent words...they turn right back around and use what the rest of the world uses without issue. Those are the facts.

So get educated people, find those good (honest) souls out there in your neighborhood who will steer you AND your hard-earned money away from the hype. Your vehicles and the pocketbook will be thankful :^)

Sidenote; do some research on legal claims against boutique oils (by name) and their purported claims, and who has (or are) being investigated. Look for past cases and pending...it's an eye-opener.

Last edited by Moebius; 11-27-2012 at 09:43 AM.
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  #57  
Old 11-27-2012, 02:23 PM
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Really? Federal Trade Commission, or the Competition Bureau, or the Partnership Against Cross-border Fraud for starters. By the way, why all the company name changes? Who are you running from??

You have a knack for deliberately marginalizing / sidestepping people's points. That’s called the strawman concept – where the loser in a disagreement has no legs to stand on so invokes unrelated information to marginalized or criticise to hopefully serve their cause.

It’s not so much that your products are (definitely) no better than anyone else’s...it’s your tactics, your exaggeration of the truth, the deliberate and calculated attempts to mislead good people and part them from their hard earned money by invoking amongst other things - fear. Once you have the mark feeling uncomfortable about the integrity of their existing oil, you then hammer on them with a bunch of loosely-based half-facts and exaggeration.

If that does not get them humming your tune, then it’s on to all the “fact sheets” and “the military” bullsh!t. How do I know? Cause I spoke to you to hear for myself the unadulterated rhetoric first-hand. I was dismayed and appalled.

The outlandish claims you make about sums everything up; 600% better than any off-the-shelf oil, or OEM oils are designed(!) to kill your engine, or “ya gotta do 3-4 oil changes (or more for f&ck’s sake – depending on who I hear this gem from) before you will see any benefit”, or when end-users see discolored oil in their catchcan, especially this time of year this is interpreted by you as a major issue that points to poor oil quality when in fact it is normal condensation from inside the crankcase...the bullsh!t goes on and on and on.

I’m now(!) starting to hear from end-users from of all places - here on this forum who you have bamboozled into purchasing your products. Things like your transmission fluid causing havoc, the customer calling and you stating “well your vehicle is supposed to use a different fluid – that’s what your problem is”...only to be at a loss for words when the product you concocted was actually marked to meet that manufacturer recommendation. The list goes on.

If potential end-users of your products do not ask themselves after hearing your speel “is this too good to be true” or, “are my fears being played to” or, “am I being snowed”...then it appears they get their just desserts :^)

BTW folks, some other great sources for a more balanced opinion and some really hard-hitting facts about boutique oils are actually there for all to read - on other forums. You do not even have to be a member. Type "BND" into their search engines. Outside of this forum boutique oils in general and BND specifically are seen for what they are.
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  #58  
Old 11-27-2012, 02:33 PM
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