Is your blend of coolant really that important?

[370 HEMI]

Many people that have purchased our different materials have been asking recently about coolants.

It appears that there is a large amount of misunderstanding in regards to coolant/anti-freeze.

Since this is a very important system that many do not really understand, I will attempt to clarify the differences and why our QuantumBlue HP Gold is so much better.

Many people have anxiety about the different colors of orange, green, and purple coolants.

Many people think that green is the normal coolant and appropriate for all cars. However, the green coolant is not recommended for our LX and LC cooling systems.

It is true that as much as 40% of the engine problems that occur are either directly or indirectly resultant from improper used or wornout coolants. Neglecting this system tends to be common practice. Afterall, if there is fluid in there, it is ok right? WRONG.

There are 3 types of coolants available today:

First is the traditional I.A.T or Inorganic Additive Technology. This is considered the "conventional coolant" It contains inorganic corrosion inhibitors.....Sodium Tetraborate, Sodium benzoate, and Sodium Silicates and Phosphates.

This is how traditional coolants function. The rusting/corrosion potential for metals is the result of several competing factors. The two that are most concerning is the electrode potential, which is a measure of the tendency of a metal to oxidize (the atoms/ions of the metal combine chemically with oxygen to form a participate or create a solid like we have see in the 6.1 liter) and the protective strength and stability of the surface films. The most corrosion prone metals in an engine are the aluminum pieces and solder used in the system.

Second is called O.A.T or Organic Additive Technology. This technology ends up with an additive package that is organic sodium as opposed to inorganic sodium contents like the I.A.T coolants. The organic additives tend to last longer as they react slower. O.A.T coolants can last twice as long as the standard I.A.T which have an effective life of 30,000 miles.

Cast iron and steel both have relatively low corrosion rates in automobile engines. The simple but essential task of reducing ferrous metal corrosion is accomplished by adding inhibitors to the coolant formulation. Additionally, the corrosion products of ferrous metals are readily dissolved in the coolant and moderately stable in common coolant solutions. Ferrous metals corrosion is not a major problem in the engine our cars.

However, copper, and brass, (an alloy of copper and zinc), have higher corrosion rates then iron and steel. The old cars years ago used soldered copper radiators, and standard I.A.T and O.A.T silicate coolants protected these. The only major alternative to a brass and copper radiator is an aluminum and plastic radiator. Like ferrous metals the corrosion of brass and copper can be easily controlled through the use of sodium corrosion inhibitors which both traditional coolants have relied on for years.

Third type (which is recommended for our cars) is the H.O.A.T or Hybrid Organic Additive Technology. This type of coolant is designed more for European type vehicles and upper end manufacturers.

The Mopar OEM coolants factory installed in our cars are this type. They are designed for extended life in excess of 60,000 miles and upto 150,000 miles.

The negative or downside to this coolant is that it contains the same I.A.T and O.A.T additives that tend to react to heat and "plate out" onto surfaces and eventually buildup in the coolant passages and lower water jacket as does the other two types of manufacture.

The reason for the H.O.A.T spec is that corrosion of aluminum can be quite a different problem because of its electrode potential. Aluminum is the most corrosion prone metal in an engine (radiator and heads). Only magnesium sodium and potassium have a greater oxidation potential (these metals will burn/oxidize violently) The reason our precious heads and radiators do not turn into lumps of white powder is that aluminum oxides tend to form stable surface films on the cooling/engine waterways.

However aluminum is particularly sensitive to a process, called erosion-corrosion where a rapidly flowing fluid can remove the protective oxide layer. Erosion can be controlled by limiting the surface flow rate of coolant to 3 m/s or less. This is easily achieved everywhere except at the water pump.

The most vulnerable aluminum component in many engines is the water pump. Water pumps and their housings are susceptible to corrosion caused by erosion-corrosion and cavitation. Cavitation causes the formation and subsequent collapsing of high pressure vapor cavities, which exert high mechanical forces on metal surfaces. Erosion corrosion is the process whereby a flowing fluid surface destroys the protective film giving corrosion free play. The results of both reactions are very similar which produces severe localized damage.

The rate of cavitation is affected by a number of factors. Increasing the fluid density or fluid boiling point tends to increase cavitation While increasing viscosity, compressibility or dissolved gases tends to reduce cavitation.

These properties are effected by coolant additives and the effect on cavitation is one of the characteristics of our proprietary coolant package in the QuantumBlue Gold HP Coolant.

There are many things to understand about a cooling system and I have addressed only a few here. Using our proprietary way of making coolants, we exceed I.A.T, O.A.T, and H.O.A.T but do it without nitrates, sulfates (Sio4 which turns under heat to Sio2 or silicon dioxide.... an insoluable sand. It contains no nitrates, phosphates, a non 2EH formula.

We make our product from Ultra pure Ethylene Glycol and add our own designed inhibitors without particulates, insoluables and a formula that is stable for 5 years or 150,000 miles.

QuantumBlue HP Gold Coolant exceeds each of the following specifications:
ANFOR 15-601,

BS 6580 (British Standard),

Chrysler MS7170,
and Chrysler MS9769,

Ford ESE-M97B44-A,
Ford WSS-M97B44-D,
and Ford WSS-M97B41-A1,

FVV HEFT R443 (Germany),

GM 1825M,
and GM 6277M (DEX-COOL Spec - Replacement),

JASO M325 (Japan),
and JIS K 2234 (Japan),

SAE J1034,

ASTM D-3306
and ASTM D-4340

also Mercedes Benz DBL 7700.

I am sure there are many other questions but this is a good start in discussing this subject.:bigthumb:

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC:driving:
440-821-9040

[CentralNJRT]

Great information. Glad I have your coolant sitting right next to me waiting to be put in my car.

[wickedchargerrt]

Many people that have purchased our different materials have been asking recently about coolants.

It appears that there is a large amount of misunderstanding in regards to coolant/anti-freeze.

yes :yes: tons of misinformed people

Since this is a very important system that many do not really understand, I will attempt to clarify the differences and why our QuantumBlue HP Gold is so much better.

Many people have anxiety about the different colors of orange, green, and purple coolants.
gold, fords new dark blue and pink also

Many people think that green is the normal coolant and appropriate for all cars. However, the green coolant is not recommended for our LX and LC cooling systems.

those people need to leave the 80's and get to reality. green or ethynene glycol is the worst possible concoction next to pouring skim milk in the degas bottle
It is true that as much as 40% of the engine problems that occur are either directly or indirectly resultant from improper used or wornout coolants. Neglecting this system tends to be common practice. Afterall, if there is fluid in there, it is ok right? WRONG.

There are 3 types of coolants available today:

First is the traditional I.A.T or Inorganic Additive Technology. This is considered the "conventional coolant" It contains inorganic corrosion inhibitors.....Sodium Tetraborate, Sodium benzoate, and Sodium Silicates and Phosphates.

This is how traditional coolants function. The rusting/corrosion potential for metals is the result of several competing factors. The two that are most concerning is the electrode potential, which is a measure of the tendency of a metal to oxidize (the atoms/ions of the metal combine chemically with oxygen to form a participate or create a solid like we have see in the 6.1 liter) and the protective strength and stability of the surface films. The most corrosion prone metals in an engine are the aluminum pieces and solder used in the system.

Second is called O.A.T or Organic Additive Technology. This technology ends up with an additive package that is organic sodium as opposed to inorganic sodium contents like the I.A.T coolants. The organic additives tend to last longer as they react slower. O.A.T coolants can last twice as long as the standard I.A.T which have an effective life of 30,000 miles.

Cast iron and steel both have relatively low corrosion rates in automobile engines. The simple but essential task of reducing ferrous metal corrosion is accomplished by adding inhibitors to the coolant formulation. Additionally, the corrosion products of ferrous metals are readily dissolved in the coolant and moderately stable in common coolant solutions. Ferrous metals corrosion is not a major problem in the engine our cars.

However, copper, and brass, (an alloy of copper and zinc), have higher corrosion rates then iron and steel. The old cars years ago used soldered copper radiators, and standard I.A.T and O.A.T silicate coolants protected these. The only major alternative to a brass and copper radiator is an aluminum and plastic radiator. Like ferrous metals the corrosion of brass and copper can be easily controlled through the use of sodium corrosion inhibitors which both traditional coolants have relied on for years.

Third type (which is recommended for our cars) is the H.O.A.T or Hybrid Organic Additive Technology. This type of coolant is designed more for European type vehicles and upper end manufacturers.

The Mopar OEM coolants factory installed in our cars are this type. They are designed for extended life in excess of 60,000 miles and upto 150,000 miles.

The negative or downside to this coolant is that it contains the same I.A.T and O.A.T additives that tend to react to heat and "plate out" onto surfaces and eventually buildup in the coolant passages and lower water jacket as does the other two types of manufacture.

The reason for the H.O.A.T spec is that corrosion of aluminum can be quite a different problem because of its electrode potential. Aluminum is the most corrosion prone metal in an engine (radiator and heads). Only magnesium sodium and potassium have a greater oxidation potential (these metals will burn/oxidize violently) The reason our precious heads and radiators do not turn into lumps of white powder is that aluminum oxides tend to form stable surface films on the cooling/engine waterways.

However aluminum is particularly sensitive to a process, called erosion-corrosion where a rapidly flowing fluid can remove the protective oxide layer. Erosion can be controlled by limiting the surface flow rate of coolant to 3 m/s or less. This is easily achieved everywhere except at the water pump.

The most vulnerable aluminum component in many engines is the water pump. Water pumps and their housings are susceptible to corrosion caused by erosion-corrosion and cavitation. Cavitation causes the formation and subsequent collapsing of high pressure vapor cavities, which exert high mechanical forces on metal surfaces. Erosion corrosion is the process whereby a flowing fluid surface destroys the protective film giving corrosion free play. The results of both reactions are very similar which produces severe localized damage.

The rate of cavitation is affected by a number of factors. Increasing the fluid density or fluid boiling point tends to increase cavitation While increasing viscosity, compressibility or dissolved gases tends to reduce cavitation.

These properties are effected by coolant additives and the effect on cavitation is one of the characteristics of our proprietary coolant package in the QuantumBlue Gold HP Coolant.

There are many things to understand about a cooling system and I have addressed only a few here. Using our proprietary way of making coolants, we exceed I.A.T, O.A.T, and H.O.A.T but do it without nitrates, sulfates (Sio4 which turns under heat to Sio2 or silicon dioxide.... an insoluable sand. It contains no nitrates, phosphates, a non 2EH formula.

We make our product from Ultra pure Ethylene Glycol and add our own designed inhibitors without particulates, insoluables and a formula that is stable for 5 years or 150,000 miles.

QuantumBlue HP Gold Coolant exceeds each of the following specifications:
ANFOR 15-601,

BS 6580 (British Standard),

Chrysler MS7170,
and Chrysler MS9769,

Ford ESE-M97B44-A,
Ford WSS-M97B44-D,
and Ford WSS-M97B41-A1,

FVV HEFT R443 (Germany),

GM 1825M,
and GM 6277M (DEX-COOL Spec - Replacement),

JASO M325 (Japan),
and JIS K 2234 (Japan),

SAE J1034,

ASTM D-3306
and ASTM D-4340

also Mercedes Benz DBL 7700.

I am sure there are many other questions but this is a good start in discussing this subject.:bigthumb:

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC:driving:
440-821-9040


Some more info

- i've stated this process before but few people seemed to really follow or believe it. You need to also check your coolant for voltage present when checking the system. As coolants break down radiator and internal waterpump bearings it starts to pick up small particles of iron and aluminum. As coolant breaks down it becomes more conductive and since coolant flows through the engine it picks up parts of left over electrons on the ground side of the electrical system. This causes even more rapid development of corrosion in the cooling system cause as electricity flows into the coolant it jumps on and off of metal causing small sparks and corrosion, much like what people see on battery posts that are leaking sulfuric acid out of the positive post (and damn it people quit pouring coke on it and ruining your battery :no:)
You check the cooling system after 60k for voltage by putting a voltmeter on the positive post and the neg lead in the coolant degas bottle while the vehicle is cold but on. A reading of .3v or more is a sign the coolant has broken down and is conducting electricity> this can also be a sign that the ground system on the car has high resistance and thus is grounding through the coolant as it is a easier path to ground if the resistance is too high on the chassis grounds.
Checking for voltage drop is just as essential as checking ethynene glycol with a hydrometer. A hydrometer is the other proper way to check for proper mixture however the market is not equipped with many HOAT, IAT, and OAT hydrometers. Most are for e.g. coolant only.

Stop leak is the next biggest joke. Stop leak kills water pumps, stops up heater cores and hoses and will damage and clog radiators. If you have a leak, fix it, duh. :confused: Stop leak does nothing but cause major restrictions in the very small passages of the cooling system. Think your cool and add stop leak to our cars. Then when your heater core poops out and it costs you 1000 dollars to pull the dash, evac the a/c system and replace the core then you can laugh at your own stupidity. Let alone when they charge you another 100 bucks for the 2.25 lbs of freon it'll take to refill the a/c plus your chrysler 20 dollar a gallon coolant if your not running brians stuff.

Just about every single cooling system fault out there is coolant or customer caused.

Spend a little now, be safe and reliable, or spend a lot later. Period

[370 HEMI]

Some more info

- i've stated this process before but few people seemed to really follow or believe it. You need to also check your coolant for voltage present when checking the system. As coolants break down radiator and internal waterpump bearings it starts to pick up small particles of iron and aluminum. As coolant breaks down it becomes more conductive and since coolant flows through the engine it picks up parts of left over electrons on the ground side of the electrical system. This causes even more rapid development of corrosion in the cooling system cause as electricity flows into the coolant it jumps on and off of metal causing small sparks and corrosion, much like what people see on battery posts that are leaking sulfuric acid out of the positive post (and damn it people quit pouring coke on it and ruining your battery :no:)
You check the cooling system after 60k for voltage by putting a voltmeter on the positive post and the neg lead in the coolant degas bottle while the vehicle is cold but on. A reading of .3v or more is a sign the coolant has broken down and is conducting electricity> this can also be a sign that the ground system on the car has high resistance and thus is grounding through the coolant as it is a easier path to ground if the resistance is too high on the chassis grounds.
Checking for voltage drop is just as essential as checking ethynene glycol with a hydrometer. A hydrometer is the other proper way to check for proper mixture however the market is not equipped with many HOAT, IAT, and OAT hydrometers. Most are for e.g. coolant only.

Stop leak is the next biggest joke. Stop leak kills water pumps, stops up heater cores and hoses and will damage and clog radiators. If you have a leak, fix it, duh. :confused: Stop leak does nothing but cause major restrictions in the very small passages of the cooling system. Think your cool and add stop leak to our cars. Then when your heater core poops out and it costs you 1000 dollars to pull the dash, evac the a/c system and replace the core then you can laugh at your own stupidity. Let alone when they charge you another 100 bucks for the 2.25 lbs of freon it'll take to refill the a/c plus your chrysler 20 dollar a gallon coolant if your not running brians stuff.

Just about every single cooling system fault out there is coolant or customer caused.

Spend a little now, be safe and reliable, or spend a lot later. Period

Wicked, I couldn't agree more. Electrical conductivity was something I was going to add but the post was getting long enough. Very true on the hydrometer. The world of coolants have changed and so has the needs of our cooling systems in the LX and LC cars. Unwise to pay too little and pay a lot later.

Thanks
Brian
440-821-9040 :bigthumb:

[racerX9]

Wicked, I couldn't agree more. Electrical conductivity was something I was going to add but the post was getting long enough. Very true on the hydrometer. The world of coolants have changed and so has the needs of our cooling systems in the LX and LC cars. Unwise to pay too little and pay a lot later.

Thanks
Brian
440-821-9040 :bigthumb:


Wow! Great information guys. I will give this a shot ("check coolant for voltage present") when we get back from Colorado. We have been doing a lot of driving with work and little weekend trips that are about 200 to 450 miles. Now we are going to Denver in a week which Google shows as 672 one way (round trip 1,344) and that doesn't include the driving around when we are there.

Bryan,
I still have about 3 quarters of a milk gallon left of coolant. I have been checking the degas bottle and have not seen any black stuff floating in the bottle, or any need to add any coolant. So I feel confident that that is ok now. However, should I worry about the extra coolant mix I have? Moreover, we have been in the mid- to upper-90s and for the next few days we will break the 100's. The car has been running around 203 to 210 the majority of the time, and it has gotten as hot as 212 about 2 or 3 times, but that was in extreme stop and go traffic. Although normal in Dallas, it's not so normal in Oklahoma. Any advice...

[370 HEMI]

Wow! Great information guys. I will give this a shot ("check coolant for voltage present") when we get back from Colorado. We have been doing a lot of driving with work and little weekend trips that are about 200 to 450 miles. Now we are going to Denver in a week which Google shows as 672 one way (round trip 1,344) and that doesn't include the driving around when we are there.

Bryan,
I still have about 3 quarters of a milk gallon left of coolant. I have been checking the degas bottle and have not seen any black stuff floating in the bottle, or any need to add any coolant. So I feel confident that that is ok now. However, should I worry about the extra coolant mix I have? Moreover, we have been in the mid- to upper-90s and for the next few days we will break the 100's. The car has been running around 203 to 210 the majority of the time, and it has gotten as hot as 212 about 2 or 3 times, but that was in extreme stop and go traffic. Although normal in Dallas, it's not so normal in Oklahoma. Any advice...

At this point, I would put it on the shelf and use for topoff for the next 5 years. The temps are normal with the engine. I have even seen 217 on my coolant on really really hot days. Not a problem. This engine is designed to run at these temps, but having the oils and fuel catalyst in it will definitely protect it well so no worries here.

Enjoy.

Brian
440-821-9040 :bigthumb:

[Ujokin2]

Brian,

So to be on the safe side prior to putting your QuantumBlue HP coolant in we should be doing a Coolant Flush ?

As you may know I am more interested not in longetivety but in the ability to keep the tempurature as low as possible.

[370 HEMI]

Brian,

So to be on the safe side prior to putting your QuantumBlue HP coolant in we should be doing a Coolant Flush ?

As you may know I am more interested not in longetivety but in the ability to keep the tempurature as low as possible.

When it comes to any car issue, there is the best case sceanario and then the practical fix.

The best thing to do is take the car to a radiator shop and have it backflushed to get all the sediment left over from the crappy OEM Sodium laced coolants that leave a coolant/sodium mud residue in the bottom of the water jacket. This process flushes out the materials by flowing the water backwards from the normal way it flows.....picking up alot of things that would not come out on regular flow.

A less expensive and less effective way is us a flush that is designed to attack the residues in the system and get it out. Prestone and Zerex make them as do other companies. Use distilled water and follow their directions. Use Distilled water after the flush to "rinse" out the flush competely. Then use distilled water with our QuantumBlue HP Gold coolant in a 50/50 mix and you are good to go for the entire 5 years/150,000 miles. It will not breakdown like other coolants, and will not ever produce the "coolant gunk" while evacuating heat much faster than other coolants. One test showed it absorbing and evacuating heat 4 times faster in some cases. This is especially important when intake temperature is critical to air density and racing purposes.

Thanks,

Brian
440-821-9040 :bigthumb:

[wickedchargerrt]

I cant buy your coolant brian.
it says in my email if i drink it it will cause renal failure. :grin: I always drink coolant, its how i tell what the fluid is i'm working with

:biggrin:

[370 HEMI]

I cant buy your coolant brian.
it says in my email if i drink it it will cause renal failure. :grin: I always drink coolant, its how i tell what the fluid is i'm working with

:biggrin:

Well, we do make it with a special Ultra Pure Ethylene Glycol that will make rover turn over very quickly. No propylene glycol here. Just great stuff for car guys that love their cars and don't make a habit of drinking it.:D

I guess I will just have to trust you.

Thanks
Brian
440-821-9040 :bigthumb: