Underdrive pulley install was a breeze [Archive] - Dodge Charger Forums

: Underdrive pulley install was a breeze


jerryrmd
03-23-2009, 11:24 AM
Finally got a chance to install my underdrive pulley this weekend. My Dad and I started at 10:30 and were finished by 12:30. Thumper's write up on the install is very good and accurate. We removed the catch cain, CAI, and pulled the fans off through the bottom of the car (we had my Dad's lift from work). The old pulley came off with ease. The new pulley was a little hard to get started but Thumper was correct about grinding down the old bolt to be able to get the new pulley started. After it gets started, just crank away. There is no need to grind down the new bolt for it is the same size as the old one.

Peformance: I can tell a difference (not drastic but my car does feel stronger through out the RPM range. Good mod for the money and time.

thumper07
03-23-2009, 11:30 AM
Awesome. Glad you did it quicker than me. We were outside in the sun with no lift and a box full of mis-matched tools. It took us a little bit, but it's just nuts and bolts. It's not rocket science :)

It took us a little bit to think of that trick of grinding down the washer on the old bolt and using it to start creeping the new pulley on with. But it worked great. I don't know why more people don't do this mod, especially with us already taking out all the guess work.

If I had the chance to do it again, knowing what I know now, it would be a lickety split job.

I think this is something everyone should do.

Glad yours went smooth!!

RaaDODGE
03-23-2009, 11:42 AM
great to know that put can you post some pic's if you got any, cause it might help me to install mine.

thumper07
03-23-2009, 11:44 AM
I'm mad at myself for not taking pictures during my install.

jerryrmd
03-23-2009, 11:59 AM
Same Here:)

jerryrmd
03-23-2009, 12:00 PM
Thumper, when are you going to the track again to see if that pulley helped out?

Hemi31
03-23-2009, 12:05 PM
Finally got a chance to install my underdrive pulley this weekend. My Dad and I started at 10:30 and were finished by 12:30. Thumper's write up on the install is very good and accurate. We removed the catch cain, CAI, and pulled the fans off through the bottom of the car (we had my Dad's lift from work). The old pulley came off with ease. The new pulley was a little hard to get started but Thumper was correct about grinding down the old bolt to be able to get the new pulley started. After it gets started, just crank away. There is no need to grind down the new bolt for it is the same size as the old one.

Peformance: I can tell a difference (not drastic but my car does feel stronger through out the RPM range. Good mod for the money and time.Which method did you use to lock the crank so you could torque it to 129lbft?I found overlapping the old belt on itself while a second person holds it works well.Locking the flywheel if I am alone.

thumper07
03-23-2009, 12:06 PM
Saturday was the first points race of this years Challenge Series. The track is about 1 1/2 hours away. It was raining pretty badly when I left my house. But, I drove all the way up there because I knew that I'd at least get 5 tech points for showing up. Which goes toward my overall points accumulation. There were 2 other Chargers there with the same idea. We were just sitting there because it was pouring. So I went up to ask the new director about the 5 tech points and he said they are not doing that this year! We were ticked off about that because we all traveled so far. So, we left.

They are supposedly re-scheduling the race for next weekend. But, nothing has been confirmed yet. So, we'll see.

But, with summer coming, our times are only going to get worse and worse until the fall. I'm not expecting to beat my posted time. Not until the fall at least.

thumper07
03-23-2009, 12:07 PM
Which method did you use to lock the crank so you could torque it to 129lbft?I found overlapping the old belt on itself while a second person holds it works well.Locking the flywheel if I am alone.

Transmission inspection cover. Stuck a screwdriver in there. I didn't use torque specs.

Phanta5m
03-23-2009, 12:08 PM
Finally got a chance to install my underdrive pulley this weekend. My Dad and I started at 10:30 and were finished by 12:30. Thumper's write up on the install is very good and accurate. We removed the catch cain, CAI, and pulled the fans off through the bottom of the car (we had my Dad's lift from work). The old pulley came off with ease. The new pulley was a little hard to get started but Thumper was correct about grinding down the old bolt to be able to get the new pulley started. After it gets started, just crank away. There is no need to grind down the new bolt for it is the same size as the old one.

Peformance: I can tell a difference (not drastic but my car does feel stronger through out the RPM range. Good mod for the money and time.

good to hear... glad you're happy... i've only heard good things about this mod:cowsmile:

Hemi31
03-23-2009, 12:12 PM
I didn't use torque specs.Well I suggest you check your bolt.......they tend to loosen up if not torqued properly.....and just so everyone knows,if the bolt loosens and the pulley moves out the lower timing gear can slide out on the crank.If the bolt loosens and the pulley spins on the crank,the crank will be galled.

Oh....and anyone that doesn't think that bolt can loosen just remember you are spinning that motor at 6000rpm in the same clockwise direction as the bolt threads......which will force it in the opposite direction if it's not tight enough.

jerryrmd
03-23-2009, 07:32 PM
Good point, what is the torque spec? And I also used a crowbar on the flywheels bolt to keep it from turning.

Hemi31
03-23-2009, 07:36 PM
Torque spec is 129 ftlbs.

thumper07
03-23-2009, 07:58 PM
I might check mine this weekend too. I'm a strong guy and, if anything, probably over torqued it.

wickedchargerrt
03-23-2009, 08:31 PM
ha, its only a new engine if it flys off, no big deal :grin:

I just put a big breaker bar on the bolt, then start the car. When the breaker bar flings over and hits the ground the motor torques the bolt for me.









:eek: ok, not really

Hemi31
03-23-2009, 08:39 PM
I might check mine this weekend too. I'm a strong guy and, if anything, probably over torqued it.
Overtorqued can be bad too........
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e379/ESC3/Boltandbox001.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e379/ESC3/Boltandbox002.jpg

Can't even begin to tell you how much fun this was........I ever find the guy that put this bolt in he's getting kicked in the nuts.

DCX Depot-Tim C
03-23-2009, 08:59 PM
Ohh man look at that pic. Nope, broken bolts are no fun at all.


Congrats on you pulley install, now go out and have some fun with it.

Tim C

thumper07
03-23-2009, 10:24 PM
Nope, I wish I were that strong to break a bolt that size. I'd need some serious leverage to do that.

How'd you get that out?

wickedchargerrt
03-23-2009, 10:31 PM
Nope, I wish I were that strong to break a bolt that size. I'd need some serious leverage to do that.

How'd you get that out?

It doesnt take anything to break a bolt that size. You can do it with two fingers if you have a big half inch breaker bar 2 ft long on it.

you have to try and use an extractor kit. Basically drill a hole in the bolt and try to put left handed thread bolt in that hole that tightens as you turn it counterclockwise in hopes that it pulls out the other piece. <-basically
Or you could replace the crank :no:

Takes even less leverage if you hit with a impact.

Hey dont feel bad. When you go back to loosen an overly tightened bolt, you'll get a chance to break it then too. You can break em by loosing and not just tightening

e.honda
03-23-2009, 10:52 PM
If you're careful there's a way to weld nuts to the tops of your broken bolts. All ya need is a mig welder and some patience. the bolts come right out!

Back on topic tho, is there any pix of this mod? I'd love to have some red pulleys. Since I'm new to Mopars tho I haven't really had a chance to shop around and see what all is available.

wickedchargerrt
03-23-2009, 11:00 PM
If you're careful there's a way to weld nuts to the tops of your broken bolts. All ya need is a mig welder and some patience. the bolts come right out!

Back on topic tho, is there any pix of this mod? I'd love to have some red pulleys. Since I'm new to Mopars tho I haven't really had a chance to shop around and see what all is available.

ppp/s is chrome and fri's is yellow (i think , from memory) . I think slp makes one too but i dont know the color, havent done any of them. I havent seen any red ones nor is this in a highly visible location or anything. If you have the intake tube on few people are gonna see it

Hemi31
03-24-2009, 06:12 AM
It doesnt take anything to break a bolt that size. You can do it with two fingers if you have a big half inch breaker bar 2 ft long on it.

you have to try and use an extractor kit. Basically drill a hole in the bolt and try to put left handed thread bolt in that hole that tightens as you turn it counterclockwise in hopes that it pulls out the other piece. <-basically
Or you could replace the crank :no:

Takes even less leverage if you hit with a impact.

Hey dont feel bad. When you go back to loosen an overly tightened bolt, you'll get a chance to break it then too. You can break em by loosing and not just tighteningYou cannot drill that bolt......you actually need to drill the crank snout since it broke so deep and retap for a larger bolt.

If you're careful there's a way to weld nuts to the tops of your broken bolts. All ya need is a mig welder and some patience. the bolts come right out!
.HArd to weld when the bolt is 2 1/2" in the crank,and the bolt is seized in place......if it didn't turn out on it's own it's not going to turn out with a welded stud.The threads in our cranks and crank bolts like to gall very easy.....one of the reasons anti sieze and a new bolt are used every time you pull the balancer.

thumper07
03-24-2009, 07:44 AM
Although it was a new bolt, I cleaned the threads with a thread cleaner/stripper over and over and over again. You'd be surprised how much gunk and metal shavings were actually taken off it, even though it was new. They are NOT quality bolts and the threads are not straight at all. Maybe that's one of the reasons it got so jammed in there?

Hemi31
03-24-2009, 08:16 AM
Although it was a new bolt, I cleaned the threads with a thread cleaner/stripper over and over and over again. You'd be surprised how much gunk and metal shavings were actually taken off it, even though it was new. They are NOT quality bolts and the threads are not straight at all. Maybe that's one of the reasons it got so jammed in there?Absolutely a contributing factor.......I am pretty sure the one in the pic was run in with an impact gun.....another huge no no.The bolt galled before the balancer was fully seated.This was done by the dealer before the car was delivered.After disassembly I found a cam lobe with some bad wear and the lifter was clean....I assume the dealer replaced a bad lifter and not the cam.....anyway......if you are going to draw the balancer in with the bolt always do it by hand so you don't risk hurting the threads.

thumper07
03-24-2009, 08:54 AM
Hm, now that I think back, I put antiseize on the balancer but not the bolt itself. In fact, I think I put some locktite on the bolt. I hope that doesn't f_ck me up.

thumper07
03-24-2009, 08:55 AM
I'd love to have some red pulleys. Since I'm new to Mopars tho I haven't really had a chance to shop around and see what all is available.

You're looking for an anodized pulley kit? I haven't yet seen one for our cars.

e.honda
03-24-2009, 09:01 AM
You cannot drill that bolt......you actually need to drill the crank snout since it broke so deep and retap for a larger bolt.

HArd to weld when the bolt is 2 1/2" in the crank,and the bolt is seized in place......if it didn't turn out on it's own it's not going to turn out with a welded stud.The threads in our cranks and crank bolts like to gall very easy.....one of the reasons anti sieze and a new bolt are used every time you pull the balancer.
Are they just pot metal then? You're making it sound like some of these part are put on with chinese grade bolts. I'm kinda scared to do mine now. :(
You're looking for an anodized pulley kit? I haven't yet seen one for our cars.
Yeah I was thinking like the Mustang stuff. It would be cool to put some anodized red stuff under the hood or at least Hemi orange to match the intake cover. I could always have the yellow ones powder coated.

Hemi31
03-24-2009, 09:25 AM
Are they just pot metal then? You're making it sound like some of these part are put on with chinese grade bolts. I'm kinda scared to do mine now. :(

lol........no.....and I should have said.....the bolt will not just break off but sieze.......the only way to remove it is to break it of and redrill the crank.It takes more force than you would believe to actually break it.But if it is galled and siezed your screwed;)

e.honda
03-24-2009, 09:32 AM
lol........no.....and I should have said.....the bolt will not just break off but sieze.......the only way to remove it is to break it of and redrill the crank.It takes more force than you would believe to actually break it.But if it is galled and siezed your screwed;)

Thats good. I work on old motorcycles for hobby so I'm used to nearly half the friggin bolts coming apart on me. When its 2.5" in something like a crank tho it is definately time for me to take it to someone more seasoned in the excavation of seized poo. haha Thanks for the info, I'm looking at a tuning kit. I might try to buy the pulleys, tuner, and CAI all at the same time. They're advertising 45 horses with that but it seems a little far fetched. I want to add hi-flow cats, headers, and cat back too. I'm just not sure how much of it is actually necessary. If I'm only going to get 2 horses out of the headers then I don't think the money is worth it.

thumper07
03-24-2009, 09:40 AM
I work on old motorcycles for hobby so I'm used to nearly half the friggin bolts coming apart on me.

That's because you're working on Harleys :) World renowned for the biggest pieces of recycled lawnmower junk parts. :biggrinjester:

wickedchargerrt
03-24-2009, 12:21 PM
You cannot drill that bolt......you actually need to drill the crank snout since it broke so deep and retap for a larger bolt.

HArd to weld when the bolt is 2 1/2" in the crank,and the bolt is seized in place......if it didn't turn out on it's own it's not going to turn out with a welded stud.The threads in our cranks and crank bolts like to gall very easy.....one of the reasons anti sieze and a new bolt are used every time you pull the balancer.

Ouch.
I was explaining the procedure for normal bolt removal, hadnt done one of these and now i'm glad i hadnt.

I think if that ever broke on my car i'd just clean the car out and walk away.

e.honda
03-24-2009, 02:05 PM
Pulleys!!! <--- still on topic :)

That's because you're working on Harleys :) World renowned for the biggest pieces of recycled lawnmower junk parts. :biggrinjester:


Actually I love American Heritage but I've never been to much of a Hardley fan. Here's my 30 yr old Jap cruiser that'll outrun any harley I've ever run across!

http://i44.tinypic.com/2vvt3ed.jpg

thumper07
03-24-2009, 02:43 PM
Is that a Honda CB400F?

e.honda
03-24-2009, 02:55 PM
Zuki GS1100 :)

thumper07
03-24-2009, 03:09 PM
Wow! Was I ever off on that one :)

e.honda
03-24-2009, 07:55 PM
Yeah its waaaayyyy bigger. Its every bit as big as any Harley...just a lot faster :)

I just sold a KZ400 tho. That was fun too, but I didn't work on it as long.

http://i40.tinypic.com/a2fb7o.jpg

thumper07
03-24-2009, 08:02 PM
It looked like a Honda CB...something. I just guessed 400F because they were popular back when they first came out.

Wow, that all black KZ looks nice.

I'm getting ready to trade my CBR in for a new Triumph Sprint RS. I want the hard bags so I can take some nice trips this summer.

e.honda
03-24-2009, 08:04 PM
It looked like a Honda CB...something. I just guessed 400F because they were popular back when they first came out.

Wow, that all black KZ looks nice.

I'm getting ready to trade my CBR in for a new Triumph Sprint RS. I want the hard bags so I can take some nice trips this summer.

Thanks and CBR's are nice but I'm with you on the bags. I sold my GSXR 2 days ago and I'm looking at new metric cruisers. I can't decide between the Honda 1300 and the Yamaha 1600.

thumper07
03-24-2009, 08:09 PM
Other than looks, you can go wrong with ANY of the Big 4. I had a Yamaha Vstar 1100 that I customed out so much that I used to win trophies at Harley shows. People used to say "Wow, nice Indian" all the time, no kidding. We used to laugh at the Harley guys when they said that :)

It's all in taste, but I like the Yammy. VTX is nice too though.

e.honda
03-24-2009, 08:11 PM
you don't have any pix of the Star do ya? I'm actually leaning towards that one with some big deep sheetmetal on it that goes all the way to the ground haha and some big ass Apes!

thumper07
03-24-2009, 08:17 PM
I can email you more if you'd like. Not sure how good they come out here.

Sorry for the thread jack OP.

e.honda
03-24-2009, 08:47 PM
I can email you more if you'd like. Not sure how good they come out here.

Sorry for the thread jack OP.

Nice dude!

P.S. also...sorry for the thread jack

charged up 28
03-28-2009, 11:22 PM
asasdjhsjfjf